1
Electrical and Instruments / Re: Door Ajar Light
« Last post by acbrock on Today at 15:34:55 »Yea Position 1 Works. I am going to play with it today while I try and figure out the wiring on my Fuel Sender.
Recent Posts
2
Items for Sale / Re: 1971 Pagoda Project for Sale (car is gone)
« Last post by Howard Long on Today at 14:30:20 »Sorry I did not get your email, too much political junk makes it hard to find everything. please send a Text or call.
3
Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes / Re: M129 idling issues
« Last post by ctaylor738 on Today at 12:15:22 »You can synch the carbs with an air flow meter like this one. You put it over each carb in turn and equalize the air flow by adjusting the throttle openings. This, with all the linkages disconnected and the engine "idling" as best you can get it. Then you reconnect the linkage, adjusting it so it does not disturb the settings.
https://www.amazon.com/Edelbrock-4025-CARB-SYNCHRONIZER/dp/B00062YC2E/ref=sr_1_23?dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Heyy372pcizhuKNYhAuJJUau_zjMZ_I1SmPYwkp_WE8xUlRqN-q-nIdFRJgdLONCcMcaCrwtxfsjXUV6E2uTbmFhIUvCOPzcXTMHu1RCgt78hQU4jHyQ3Iwp2GapzNU6btdzewdfaTRUdC_e9R-VApL6w_32E-Iy-2JxkX3Byo7C5G80OJ9BPrSgL2lrT1VThd2SmssTiR0f8v9X9K664A1ZDB7i_amhLoyKWhVHui7j6w0343_tXNBZAxXJh36bAiieBFVNZOjCpySW5Z66wpImDvxq4CnbziaE1gjxb18.3a66pDev14ICF4OzXgNTX1lnVuMWq8tY8WxFeem1Kgs&dib_tag=se&keywords=carburetor+synchronizer&qid=1716551910&sr=8-23
A less elegant way is with a piece of heater hose, one end at the carb throat and the other next to your ear. With the engine running, listen to each carb and try to equalize the sound of the air moving through the throats. I am not making this up.
But I think you need to figure out the vacuum situation. Can you do the screwdriver-in-#1-sparkplug-hole to verify TDC?
Cheers,
CT
https://www.amazon.com/Edelbrock-4025-CARB-SYNCHRONIZER/dp/B00062YC2E/ref=sr_1_23?dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.Heyy372pcizhuKNYhAuJJUau_zjMZ_I1SmPYwkp_WE8xUlRqN-q-nIdFRJgdLONCcMcaCrwtxfsjXUV6E2uTbmFhIUvCOPzcXTMHu1RCgt78hQU4jHyQ3Iwp2GapzNU6btdzewdfaTRUdC_e9R-VApL6w_32E-Iy-2JxkX3Byo7C5G80OJ9BPrSgL2lrT1VThd2SmssTiR0f8v9X9K664A1ZDB7i_amhLoyKWhVHui7j6w0343_tXNBZAxXJh36bAiieBFVNZOjCpySW5Z66wpImDvxq4CnbziaE1gjxb18.3a66pDev14ICF4OzXgNTX1lnVuMWq8tY8WxFeem1Kgs&dib_tag=se&keywords=carburetor+synchronizer&qid=1716551910&sr=8-23
A less elegant way is with a piece of heater hose, one end at the carb throat and the other next to your ear. With the engine running, listen to each carb and try to equalize the sound of the air moving through the throats. I am not making this up.
But I think you need to figure out the vacuum situation. Can you do the screwdriver-in-#1-sparkplug-hole to verify TDC?
Cheers,
CT
4
Electrical and Instruments / Re: speedometer adjustement
« Last post by georgem on Today at 07:57:46 »Hi Loic,
5km isn,t much although it can be annoying esp comparing it to a modern speedo.
The "error" could be the fault of a difference in the current tyre circumference and the original tyres. Unfortunately there is not an owner operator fix - it will have to come out and off to a speedo repair shop you go.............on the other hand.......you could suffer the difference and be thankful that its probably saving you from many speeding fines
5km isn,t much although it can be annoying esp comparing it to a modern speedo.
The "error" could be the fault of a difference in the current tyre circumference and the original tyres. Unfortunately there is not an owner operator fix - it will have to come out and off to a speedo repair shop you go.............on the other hand.......you could suffer the difference and be thankful that its probably saving you from many speeding fines
5
Electrical and Instruments / speedometer adjustement
« Last post by loic on Today at 06:52:03 »Good morning
Is it possible to manually adjust the speedometer to have a more accurate speed. Mine says 5 km/h more. THANKS
Bonjour
Est-il possible de régler manuellement le compteur de vitesses pour avoir une vitesse plus précise. Le mien indique 5 km/h de plus. Merci
Is it possible to manually adjust the speedometer to have a more accurate speed. Mine says 5 km/h more. THANKS
Bonjour
Est-il possible de régler manuellement le compteur de vitesses pour avoir une vitesse plus précise. Le mien indique 5 km/h de plus. Merci
6
Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes / Re: Upper engine or lower engine noise - Please identify.
« Last post by Artkez on Today at 04:53:15 »That maybe the best option. It also sounds like rod knock. Maybe the engine got starved of oil or some like that.
Hello Pinder, Cees and Peter
Well i think as Pinder was correct and dead on with the diagnosis but too bad you could not be my mechanic.
The engine did not have the proper amount of oil to the engine. We noticed the knock in the lower part of the engine, we decided to take it all apart and see the problem .
Many mentioned that the noise seemed like a valve problem and it seems that the lack of oil really resulted in a metal to metal grinding noise.
I have attached a picture of the oil line and it seems like there is a large Kink in the line probably starving the engine of about 80 % of needed oil flow.
i check the oil pressure gauge on the dash and it seemed normal, i wish there was a way to see how much oil was really getting to the inside of the engine due to the kinked hose
I can not imagine how this kink developed or when it happened ?? I have also attached pictures of the current condition of the opened engine, the knocking sound they say was coming from the looseness of the piston in their cylinder . Ironically the bearings in the rods and the main bearing all look like new. Cam shaft look new as well.
I almost wish that we could get a new oil hose and put the engine back together and see if the knocking goes away.
Our current decision is to send it to Mike at Metric Motors and let him do his magic and then hoping that my mechanic can put it back together, ( He seems very confident that all will be great)
I am so sorry that we could not find the faulty oil hose damage sooner
Thanks for all you comments and advise, really appreciate it
Arthur
7
Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes / Re: M129 idling issues
« Last post by Heckflosse on Today at 03:01:46 »Then can you please tell me the easiest way to synchronize them?
I've set and reset the carbs now at least 5 times, always with exactly the same results. There is no change in the car's running at any setting. The same problems are apparent, backfiring through both the carbs and the exhaust, as well as a three note miss. There is no vacuum below 1000 rpm, it falls right off immediately. Stepping on the gas attempting to move means a misfiring in the manifold as well as a huge explosion out the back. That's also with floats set lean or rich, it doesn't matter, it's doing this regardless of what I do.
I started with both throttle plates closed at rest, mixture screws turned 1.5 turns out. Bowl vents are clear and moving, no pressure on the bowl vent lever. Idle tubes are clear. Both floats are set to the factory specification with the same amount and type of washers in them. Travel on the floats is the same. Both floats are water tight. Triple checked that as well.
Jets cleaned and measured, all gaskets and washers replaced with new.
Choke plates both set identically.
Valve lash is set.
It will start instantly set like this, but it dies instantly as the rpm comes down, it will not even attempt to idle. The only way to idle it is to open up the throttle plates, ie set the idle speed. That's where it is right now, throttle plates are open about 1/4 inch, and it's still misfiring in the rear carb and trying to blow the muffler apart.
I've set and reset the carbs now at least 5 times, always with exactly the same results. There is no change in the car's running at any setting. The same problems are apparent, backfiring through both the carbs and the exhaust, as well as a three note miss. There is no vacuum below 1000 rpm, it falls right off immediately. Stepping on the gas attempting to move means a misfiring in the manifold as well as a huge explosion out the back. That's also with floats set lean or rich, it doesn't matter, it's doing this regardless of what I do.
I started with both throttle plates closed at rest, mixture screws turned 1.5 turns out. Bowl vents are clear and moving, no pressure on the bowl vent lever. Idle tubes are clear. Both floats are set to the factory specification with the same amount and type of washers in them. Travel on the floats is the same. Both floats are water tight. Triple checked that as well.
Jets cleaned and measured, all gaskets and washers replaced with new.
Choke plates both set identically.
Valve lash is set.
It will start instantly set like this, but it dies instantly as the rpm comes down, it will not even attempt to idle. The only way to idle it is to open up the throttle plates, ie set the idle speed. That's where it is right now, throttle plates are open about 1/4 inch, and it's still misfiring in the rear carb and trying to blow the muffler apart.
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Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes / Re: M129 idling issues
« Last post by Benz Dr. on Today at 01:47:57 »Your carbs are not synchronized. I had the same problem on a 230S last year.
You can spend a lot of time chasing your tail on those cars.
You can spend a lot of time chasing your tail on those cars.
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Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes / Re: M129 idling issues
« Last post by Heckflosse on Today at 00:32:06 »Thanks, already checked for that, it's unfortunately not the issue. You're absolutely right, the symptoms are the same, and I though that was the problem. So I went in and redid the carbs first. The idle circuit tubes were initially plugged before I rebuilt them the second time, but not now. Ethanol gas is a wonderful thing and these cars just thrive on it, I'm told. Ok, I'm being sarcastic.
The engine had ran Ok for 3 weeks after I rebuilt the carbs and tuned it the first time, (with complete new kits). The only complaint then was that it was incredibly hard to start cold, it took a lot of gas pedal pumping to get it to start. The idle circuit was a bit off, so I did that check and they were clogged. I've rectified that with the second rebuild, again with new kits, just to be sure. (after the engine failed) Gaskets were properly matched up with the originals, and all diaphragms were leak tested as well. I'm pretty sure there are no leaks, and spraying carb cleaner all over them while running did nothing at all.
Before it died it seemed that the carbs "flipped"; on idle the front one was prevalent, and on acceleration the back one came alive and the front one dropped off. It had a wicked stumble as a result. That's what I thought the problem was at first, so I took extra care to redo the carbs correctly and by the book this last time. It also had 13 inches of vacuum on idle at that point and the compression was 145, 150, 135, 140, 145, 145. At the time, there was no adjustment I could make that would improve the vacuum profile. Now it's a lot worse, (see above) and that after 3 short weeks of run time.
It starts now with a pump of the gas pedal, and then as it comes down off the initial pump and returns to the idle circuit it's like turning the engine off.
It's difficult to check the idle circuit because the engine will not run at all below 1000 rpm, and it threatens to die when run at a constant speed. However, I get good action and positive throttle response when I gun the motor, - until it spits and backfires out either end. Trying to move it, it has absolutely no power at all, it has to be revved up, the gas pedal feathered, and the clutch slipped a lot and then it wants to die, it will not pull, only fart and sputter out both ends. It stumbles and wants to die every time the vacuum gauge needle drops below 9, - and at 1000-1100 rpm, it's the only way it will run. And then the needle on the vacuum gauge wanders between 9-12, with the rpm increasing at the high end, and then dropping off.
The carbs have new gaskets and were checked for flatness on a lapping table or with a straight edge. The intake manifold was off and checked, and the gaskets replaced. Brake booster off line and plugged.
I'm going to try and get a hold of smoke kit just to be sure on the vacuum leaks since it will not even run in the idle circuit. That will likely be the last test and then I have to conclude it's either a cam issue or that motor is just junk. There's really no other thing it can be by that point, all the basics are there and it should run.
Yeah, it's a real head scratcher, I've never had a car do something like this before and I've hauled out some real crusty bush buggies in the past that never gave me the grief this thing is doing right now. I was lead to believe Mercedes 6 cylinders of this era were bullet proof and would withstand a lot of abuse. It appears that isn't the case, this thing is wiped out at 70,000 miles. (Ok, I'll give it that it's 60 years old.)
My apologies for the long winded replies, I just want to make sure all the information is as clear as I can get it.
The engine had ran Ok for 3 weeks after I rebuilt the carbs and tuned it the first time, (with complete new kits). The only complaint then was that it was incredibly hard to start cold, it took a lot of gas pedal pumping to get it to start. The idle circuit was a bit off, so I did that check and they were clogged. I've rectified that with the second rebuild, again with new kits, just to be sure. (after the engine failed) Gaskets were properly matched up with the originals, and all diaphragms were leak tested as well. I'm pretty sure there are no leaks, and spraying carb cleaner all over them while running did nothing at all.
Before it died it seemed that the carbs "flipped"; on idle the front one was prevalent, and on acceleration the back one came alive and the front one dropped off. It had a wicked stumble as a result. That's what I thought the problem was at first, so I took extra care to redo the carbs correctly and by the book this last time. It also had 13 inches of vacuum on idle at that point and the compression was 145, 150, 135, 140, 145, 145. At the time, there was no adjustment I could make that would improve the vacuum profile. Now it's a lot worse, (see above) and that after 3 short weeks of run time.
It starts now with a pump of the gas pedal, and then as it comes down off the initial pump and returns to the idle circuit it's like turning the engine off.
It's difficult to check the idle circuit because the engine will not run at all below 1000 rpm, and it threatens to die when run at a constant speed. However, I get good action and positive throttle response when I gun the motor, - until it spits and backfires out either end. Trying to move it, it has absolutely no power at all, it has to be revved up, the gas pedal feathered, and the clutch slipped a lot and then it wants to die, it will not pull, only fart and sputter out both ends. It stumbles and wants to die every time the vacuum gauge needle drops below 9, - and at 1000-1100 rpm, it's the only way it will run. And then the needle on the vacuum gauge wanders between 9-12, with the rpm increasing at the high end, and then dropping off.
The carbs have new gaskets and were checked for flatness on a lapping table or with a straight edge. The intake manifold was off and checked, and the gaskets replaced. Brake booster off line and plugged.
I'm going to try and get a hold of smoke kit just to be sure on the vacuum leaks since it will not even run in the idle circuit. That will likely be the last test and then I have to conclude it's either a cam issue or that motor is just junk. There's really no other thing it can be by that point, all the basics are there and it should run.
Yeah, it's a real head scratcher, I've never had a car do something like this before and I've hauled out some real crusty bush buggies in the past that never gave me the grief this thing is doing right now. I was lead to believe Mercedes 6 cylinders of this era were bullet proof and would withstand a lot of abuse. It appears that isn't the case, this thing is wiped out at 70,000 miles. (Ok, I'll give it that it's 60 years old.)
My apologies for the long winded replies, I just want to make sure all the information is as clear as I can get it.
10
General Discussion / Re: Original 280SL Owners Manual available
« Last post by Richard Madison on Today at 00:19:48 »Hello to those of you who have emailed about the Manual.
The Manual has been offerred to the first responder.
Regret there were are not enough manuals for all...that is the challenge and the disappointment of collecting vintage items.
Thank you for your interest.
A special shout out to my old friends Cees ,Michael, and others...many happy Pagoda memories.
Richard M, NYC
The Manual has been offerred to the first responder.
Regret there were are not enough manuals for all...that is the challenge and the disappointment of collecting vintage items.
Thank you for your interest.
A special shout out to my old friends Cees ,Michael, and others...many happy Pagoda memories.
Richard M, NYC