Author Topic: Power brake booster  (Read 8517 times)

James

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Power brake booster
« on: October 22, 2018, 02:30:27 »
Hi all
This is s problem that we will all have to face
The power brake booster has an internal “Bakelite “ component that cracks with age and causes the power brake booster to leak. This affects the performance of the engine and the braking.
Does anybody know where to get a repair or a new brake booster .
I’ve tried many brake and MB spare parts suppliers to no avail.
This problem will affect all our Pagodas at some time
I would be grateful for your advice and assistance
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

450sl

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2018, 09:15:13 »
Hi James , you could buy a new one.

Pdf is the one for a 280

mbzse

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2018, 09:33:52 »
Quote from: 450sl
.../...you could buy a new one...
Unfortunately, the units offered on the market today differ quite a lot from what was in our cars from factory.
See images attached, "late Type 4" is correct as from factory for later 280SL (no "notch" above brake master cylinder on this one)
Other image "T51 bromsservo 3" is the type offered today, looks very different to the original type fitted in the W113
« Last Edit: February 12, 2019, 22:41:10 by mbzse »
/Hans S

stickandrudderman

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2018, 12:17:13 »
These Bakelite components are only for RHD cars.
I am in the process of having some made but delivery is not imminent.

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2018, 18:12:00 »
Excellent
Thank you for your information .No one else has known that
Do you know if the booster can presently be purchased new?
Is there something that can be done as a temporary replacement in the interim?
Any other suggestions
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

zak

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2018, 20:18:04 »
James, you could disconnect the brake booster and drive with manual brakes.
The 1/2 inch hose into the booster front gets disconnected and then you put a bolt or screw into the disconnected hose to seal it and preserve vacuum.
My mechanic did this to my 250 SL a few years back when my booster was leaking and it actually improved performance.
And the manual braking is fun and safe. You just have to stand on the brake pedal a bit.


jz 
1967 250 SL
1983 280 SL
2015 ML 250 Bluetec
2007 ML CDI
2004 E 320 Wagon
1999 E300 Turbodiesel

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2018, 20:25:37 »
Thank you Zac
I will do that
At least I’ll be back on the road for the holidays
It’s been in his garage for 12 weeks while we looked for a replacement
I will still have to find a fix though
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2018, 20:28:35 »
Hi again
Could you please give me the details of your contact who’s making the part and I can put in an order too
Thank you
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

Garry

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2018, 21:00:43 »
James,

Do not do as Zak suggested, and as another member has pointed out to me, It is completely illegal and a highly dangerous thing to do disconnecting the brake booster then driving.

Garry
Membership Admin
« Last Edit: October 23, 2018, 21:21:47 by Garry »
Garry Marks
Melbourne/ Kyneton, Brisbane. Australia
1969 MB 280SL 5 speed RHD SOLD.
1965 MB 230SL Auto RHD Lt Blue 334G, Top 350H, 213 Leather, Tourist Delivery.
1972 MB 280CE Auto RHD 906G Blue Grey
2005 MB A200.
2006 MB B200
2019 Izuzu DMax 4x4 with Slide-on camper.
2022 Volvo XC40 Twin Electric

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2018, 21:07:42 »
Thank you Garry
Very important information
I wondered why the mechanic hadn’t done it
... the search for the replacement/ repair continues
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2018, 21:22:49 »
...an additional question
Does anyone with technical expertise know if the RHD Ponton or RHD Fintail used the same brake booster?
They were made at the same time?
Any suggestions or comments?
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

Garry

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2018, 21:25:52 »
James,


I have had my booster overhauled about a year ago.  It was done by Joe at  Classique Motors 0396905444 in South Melbourne.  We had difficulty getting an overhaul kit but he did eventually find one.  Maybe give him a call.


Garry
Garry Marks
Melbourne/ Kyneton, Brisbane. Australia
1969 MB 280SL 5 speed RHD SOLD.
1965 MB 230SL Auto RHD Lt Blue 334G, Top 350H, 213 Leather, Tourist Delivery.
1972 MB 280CE Auto RHD 906G Blue Grey
2005 MB A200.
2006 MB B200
2019 Izuzu DMax 4x4 with Slide-on camper.
2022 Volvo XC40 Twin Electric

mbzse

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2018, 21:36:15 »
Quote from: James
.../...Does anyone with technical expertise know if [another M-B].../... used the same brake booster?
The W108/109 and W111 cp / cab did use the T51, same as our W113 Pagoda
/Hans S

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2018, 22:07:39 »
Thank you Garry but Joe is my mechanic now too and we are not having any luck

James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2018, 10:30:43 »
Thank you
That enables me to expand my search
Greatly appreciated!
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

zak

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2018, 22:30:20 »
Jeez, sorry Garry and James and all, if I advised something that is dangerous.
I did not think it was dangerous. I have heard that tip from a few mechanics and I have been driving my 250 SL with the brake booster disconnected as I described for over 5 years now with no problems at all.
I respectfully ask what exactly the danger is/may be ? I may be wrong (again), but weren't power assisted brakes an option on early 113s ?

jz
1967 250 SL
1983 280 SL
2015 ML 250 Bluetec
2007 ML CDI
2004 E 320 Wagon
1999 E300 Turbodiesel

zak

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #16 on: October 24, 2018, 22:40:59 »
Or was I thinking of power steering as an option?
Sorry again,

jz

1967 250 SL
1983 280 SL
2015 ML 250 Bluetec
2007 ML CDI
2004 E 320 Wagon
1999 E300 Turbodiesel

66andBlue

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #17 on: October 25, 2018, 00:09:28 »
Power assisted brakes were standard on all W113, power steering was an option.
Alfred
1964 230SL manual 4-speed 568H signal red
1966 230SL automatic 334G light blue (sold)
1968 280SL automatic (now 904G midnight blue)

Garry

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #18 on: October 25, 2018, 10:41:42 »
Zac


In Australia in all states, it would be illegal to modify the vehicle that way given that the brake system with booster is standard fit and would negate their insurance as well. For those reasons alone, there is a problem recommending that someone does an illegal modification. 


Having said that, anyone turning off the vehicle whilst moving knows how hard it is to brake the vehicle and would realise that it is actually difficult to stop the car with out the engine running giving the boost.  I am surprised that you have been driving that way for so long without having hit anything!!  😆
Garry Marks
Melbourne/ Kyneton, Brisbane. Australia
1969 MB 280SL 5 speed RHD SOLD.
1965 MB 230SL Auto RHD Lt Blue 334G, Top 350H, 213 Leather, Tourist Delivery.
1972 MB 280CE Auto RHD 906G Blue Grey
2005 MB A200.
2006 MB B200
2019 Izuzu DMax 4x4 with Slide-on camper.
2022 Volvo XC40 Twin Electric

James

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #19 on: October 25, 2018, 18:33:35 »
Thank you Zak... at least you are mobile! (I’m not!) 
James
James
GLC 300
E 300
1965 red 230 SL Auto RHD
 ,parchment interior
E type V12 RHD
Etype V12 1972 RHD FHC Auto

zak

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2018, 22:09:46 »
To all-
I would like to apologize for giving a short cut solution advice to solve a problem.
It works for me, but I am a risk taker. Have been all my life.
I do not want to subject the group to liability.
Sorry again,
jz
1967 250 SL
1983 280 SL
2015 ML 250 Bluetec
2007 ML CDI
2004 E 320 Wagon
1999 E300 Turbodiesel

Garry

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2018, 23:43:18 »
Zak,


Not a big deal. We need to just be a bit careful on providing info that may come back to bite both the Group and the individual given some nations fondness for litigation. ;) ;) ;D ;D


Garry
Membership Administrator
Garry Marks
Melbourne/ Kyneton, Brisbane. Australia
1969 MB 280SL 5 speed RHD SOLD.
1965 MB 230SL Auto RHD Lt Blue 334G, Top 350H, 213 Leather, Tourist Delivery.
1972 MB 280CE Auto RHD 906G Blue Grey
2005 MB A200.
2006 MB B200
2019 Izuzu DMax 4x4 with Slide-on camper.
2022 Volvo XC40 Twin Electric

Pawel66

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #22 on: October 27, 2018, 08:56:47 »
What I did for my brake booster and to stay mobile: I just bought the replacement one (that looks different than original, but fits) and put it in temporarily while my original booster was fixed. Then I could give the new temporary booster to the shop (with some loss on price, of course) or keep it for emergency. I kept it for emergency.

I know it is $$$$ (the replacement booster is about $400), if you manage to agree with the shop you may get back $200, but you are mobile.
Pawel

280SL 1970 automatic 180G Silver
W128 220SE
W121 190SL
G-class

Pinder

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #23 on: October 27, 2018, 20:40:39 »
Rock Auto sells one for around $100. If you send your old one back they give you a core payment.

There was a minor modificaiton that had to be done to the hole on one side of the push rood which is to make it bigger so the bolt fits through. other than that its an easy swap.
1970 280 SL Light Ivory DB 670. 4 Speed manual shift no AC Limited Slip Diff.

ja17

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Re: Power brake booster
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2018, 04:13:56 »
I have seen several different versions of Mercedes brake boosters used on these Pagoda's. They which seemed to work and fit fine. Any other experiences with alternatives?
Joe Alexander
Blacklick, Ohio
1969 Dark Olive 280SL
2002 ML55 AMG (tow vehicle)
2002 SLK32 AMG (350 hp)
1982 300TD Wagon turbo 4spd.
1963 404 Mercedes Unimog (Swedish Army)
1989 flu419 Mercedes Unimog (US Army)
1998 E430
1974 450SLC Rally
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