Author Topic: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?  (Read 13741 times)

perry113

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What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« on: June 05, 2006, 21:10:53 »
I just got a 230SL running again. This car hadn't run in 20 years. In my sort out process in running 15-W40. I plan however, to switch to Mobil 1 15-W50.
Am I on the right thought process. I use 15-W50 in all my other sports car.
What are others out there using.

Out of curiousity,

Peter Perry
Peter Perry
1970 911T Bahia Red
1972 911T Albert Blau
1963 220seb coupe barn
1965 230SL Light Ivory automatic
1966 230SL Havana Brown 4 speed Barn Find
1970 280SE living 3.5 donor car

Lilly

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2006, 01:28:02 »
Achtung !  You will be making a very costly mistake using Mobil 1 or any other synthetic motor oil in your W113 SL.  I was just recently reminded the reason or reasons for not using synthetic oil in cars our age and will try to recall who, or from where I read, saw or heard the experts remind me.
Shell Rotella, Valvoline, Kendall, and, of course, Mobil branded non-synthetic oils with either a 10W30 (wintertime) or 15W40 (Spring, summer, and early fall) viscosity rating have been my car's engine lubricant for its entire life.  You see, my car was passed to me from my German-American grandmother who bought the car brand new and took direct delivery of it at the Stuttgart factory in July of 1966.  And, so, I know (having all service, maintenance and repair records since then), exactly what has been used and when it has been used in its forty year life, and the engine has never needed any major repair, it starts and runs whenever attempted no matter the season, has plenty of miles ( and expect it to go one or two hundred thousand more - grandpa drove his 220D over 400,000), and just this past weekend I drove it 370 miles with the engine happiest at 4300 RPM (approx. 80 MPH) and didn't notice any difference on the dipstick level when I returned it to its stable.  I.E., MB isn't kidding when they claim that our cars are "Engineered like no other cars in the world !"

Pagoda Lilly
« Last Edit: June 06, 2006, 01:34:22 by Lilly »

perry113

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2006, 03:43:17 »
I'm using Shell Rotella now. Why is Mobil 1 a mistake? Too slick or or leak prone?
Peter Perry
1970 911T Bahia Red
1972 911T Albert Blau
1963 220seb coupe barn
1965 230SL Light Ivory automatic
1966 230SL Havana Brown 4 speed Barn Find
1970 280SE living 3.5 donor car

JPMOSE

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2006, 05:42:33 »
I switched to synthetic 10W-40 Amsoil when I first purchased my car in January.  The engine has 133k w/o any prior work performed internally on the engine.  The synthetic oil neither leaks or gets consumed at a rate greater than the norm (so far I have put 700 miles on the the car and have used a third of one quart).

Lilly...I think older engines that have existing leaks, worn rings, and/or worn valve stem seals are not a good candidate for switching to synthetic.  However, if your older engine is still within specification and doesn't leak...synthetic oil can still be a improvement over conventional oil.

Best Regards,

J. P. Mose
1968 250SL
1987 560SL
Best Regards,

J. P. Mose
1968 250SL
1970 280SE 3.5 Cabriolet
1987 560SL

George Davis

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #4 on: June 06, 2006, 09:33:09 »
I use Mobil 1 15W-50 (or is it 15W-40?), with a fairly low milage rebuilt engine, and change oil about every 3,000 miles.  I agree with JP, there is nothing wrong with using synthetics in higher-milage engines now.  The first generation of synthetic oils tended to cause leaks in higher-milage engines, but the seal-sweller additives have been revised to eliminate this problem.  I switched to synthetic in another car with 100,000 miles on it and no leaks in 15,000 miles.

Synthetics are probably overkill, but but in the high-revving Pagoda motors a bit of overkill makes me feel better.

George Davis
'69 280 SL Euro manual

rwmastel

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #5 on: June 06, 2006, 13:45:22 »
quote:
Originally posted by Lilly

I was just recently reminded the reason or reasons for not using synthetic oil in cars our age and will try to recall who, or from where I read, saw or heard the experts remind me.
Lilly,
Yes, your source would be greatly appreciated.  I think the majority of owners think it's OK.

Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both  tops
1994 E420
Rodd
Pagoda Technical Manual, please contribute: http://www.sl113.org/wiki/pmwiki.php
1966 230SL  (waiting patiently for me)
1980 450SL  (for sale)
1997 E300 Diesel  (daily driver)
2006 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon  (off-roading)
2006 C230  (sold in 2015)
1994 E420  (sold in 2007)

perry113

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2006, 17:40:04 »
I started running 5/30 full synthetic in my 96 I30 when it had 100K on it. I have 175K and the motor doesn't burn a drop. I go 5k on it. 0 oil leaks.

I have a very hotted up 100 + MPH MGA that I built myself and run Mobil 1. Ive driven it respectfully but hard at times for over 20K. Motor is perfect but sweats oil. Can't blame that on synthetic because they all leak. The way that car revs I can't think of putting anything less worthy than full synthetic.

Just started 15/50 Mobil 1 in a 72 MFI 911 that I purchased last year. This car scream and revs like a jet plane. And as for the 230, this car is a documented 53K car. The motor sounds smooth, nice oil pressure with no smoke and healthy smelling exhaust. It revs like its stolen once rolling. For my sort out I bought Shell 15W40 Rottella for the price knowing I will change the oil multiple times with my sort out until perfectly tuned. The Rottella is rated for tractors and trucks and appears to be the oil to use as it has additives in it.
But I'm curious why you would think synthetic is wrong for this or any application.
Peter Perry
1970 911T Bahia Red
1972 911T Albert Blau
1963 220seb coupe barn
1965 230SL Light Ivory automatic
1966 230SL Havana Brown 4 speed Barn Find
1970 280SE living 3.5 donor car

dwilli3038

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #7 on: June 06, 2006, 17:48:29 »
I recall someone saying the issue is synthetics will increase leakage rates so if you are dripping oil you will regret the change but if you do not have a lot of leaks it should be fine.

Daryl
'64 230 SL
Serial # 508

perry113

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2006, 20:54:29 »
Qoute:

Originally posted by Daryl

"I recall someone saying the issue is synthetics will increase leakage rates so if you are dripping oil you will regret the change but if you do not have a lot of leaks it should be fine."

Daryl
So what are your saying? Is your 230 dripping oil?
Peter Perry
1970 911T Bahia Red
1972 911T Albert Blau
1963 220seb coupe barn
1965 230SL Light Ivory automatic
1966 230SL Havana Brown 4 speed Barn Find
1970 280SE living 3.5 donor car

Chad

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2006, 22:18:55 »
It's Mobil 1 everytime in the Mercedes vehicles. I didn't see why not.

1967 230SL (Manual)

rwmastel

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #10 on: June 07, 2006, 08:42:28 »
Perry113,

I think Daryl is saying just what he is saying.  If a car leaks oil, then it will simply be leaking more expensive oil if synthetic is used.  I don't think he mentioned his car.

Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both  tops
1994 E420
« Last Edit: June 07, 2006, 08:43:21 by rwmastel »
Rodd
Pagoda Technical Manual, please contribute: http://www.sl113.org/wiki/pmwiki.php
1966 230SL  (waiting patiently for me)
1980 450SL  (for sale)
1997 E300 Diesel  (daily driver)
2006 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon  (off-roading)
2006 C230  (sold in 2015)
1994 E420  (sold in 2007)

70chevelle

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #11 on: June 07, 2006, 12:28:19 »
My understanding of the synthetic leak theory is as follows.  Synthetic oil particles are smaller than fossil oils, ie:  where fossil oils can't go, synthetics can.  Additionally, in vehicles that have used fossil oil for most of their lives can have internal sludge buildup on seals and gaskets.  Synthetics don't create sludge and will "clean" the exisiting sludge away.  This can create leaks in these seals and gaskets once that sludge is removed.  I personally wouldn't have a problem using synthetic on a rebuilt or low mileage engine that is in good condition, I however won't use synthetic in my 100k+ mile engine that burns a little and leaks a little.  I also wouldn't break in a new motor with anything but fossil oils.  My final opinion, is that the benefit of using a synthetic, beyond better lubricity, is that you can go longer between oil changes.  Basically the increased cost is negated by the decrease in changing intervals.  If you are using synthetic and changing every 3000 miles, you are disposing of perfectly good oil, IMHO.

70 Chevelle 13.7 @ 99.7
70 280 SL Silver/Black top
05 C230 Kompressor
03 Dodge Durango SLT

Raymond

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #12 on: June 07, 2006, 15:17:08 »
There have been several threads on this.  The concensus is that problems with synthetic oils are a myth.  They neither cause nor exacerbate leaks.  They do reduce friction, improve temperature stability, resist foaming, precipitate moisture better, and last far, far longer without viscosity breakdown.

My sources are not at my fingertips, but there were thorough articles about the superiority of synthetic oils in an issue of The Star in 2005, and one issue of AOPA Pilot 2005, and a technical paper I read from Shell Oil in 2005.

Ray
'68 280SL 4-spd Coupe
Ray
'68 280SL 5-spd "California" Coupe

rmmchl

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2006, 18:25:56 »
there is nothing wrong with 10w40 oil. you guys are wasting money. I just had my 250sl engine blueprinted and balanced. I use castrol 10w40, which is what the germans used when new.
michael romeo           
1967  250sl
signal red

Bob Possel

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2006, 18:41:20 »
I use Castrol 20w50.  Engine is original with 91k miles, never been overhauled.  Compression is #1=150; #2=150; #3=160; #4=150; #5=150; #6=160

Bob


bpossel  (Memphis, TN.)
'71 280SL  /  '97 E320

J. Huber

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2006, 19:00:15 »
Well, I was recently strongly persuaded here to try synthetic next time around -- but to date I have typically used 10-30 Castrol.

James
63 230SL
James
63 230SL

dwilli3038

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #16 on: June 07, 2006, 19:29:42 »
To add to what Rod said, my car has not run since I purchased it. I have changed the oil using a petrolium based oil. When I get it running I will change it again almost immediatly. I will then survey for drips and ty to fix any I am find. After 1000 to 2000 miles I will change to Mobil 1 If it is good enough for AMG it is good enough for my 113. With only 129,000 miles my engine should last longer than me of given good care.

Daryl
'64 230 SL
Serial # 508

Raymond

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #17 on: June 10, 2006, 17:06:07 »
In 1914 the Germans used Castor oil in some aircraft engines.  The don't use that anymore either.  :mrgreen:

Ray
'68 280SL 4-spd Coupe
Ray
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Lilly

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #18 on: June 14, 2006, 04:03:26 »
One source against the use of synthetic oils in the W113:
JZ Machtech, a servicer in the UK, was permitted to answer all of the tech. questions submitted by readers of the U.K. published 911 & Porsche World magazine in the 1/04 issue.  A man submitted a question from Queensland Australia inquiring as to what type of oil he should use in his 1984 Porsche 924.  In response to him (also published in the magazine) it was stated that, with the exception of certain Turbo models, they recommended that synthetic oils only be used in cars built from 1993 onwards.
Their website for possible further explanations is:

www.jzmachtech.com


Pagoda Lilly


Lilly

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #19 on: June 14, 2006, 12:25:46 »
Upon contacting JZ Machtech in the U.K. requesting their further explanation as to why they'd not recommended the use of synthetic motor oils except in some Turbo boosted engines and normally aspirated engines made from 1993 onwards, I received the following response:  "Thank you for your email regarding engine oils.
The information which we provide is based on our experience over many years and in that time we meet many very experienced people in the trade which are experts for larger companies and give advice to companies like us. It will be almost impossible for me to pin point such data as to give you the technical reason for which oil to use. Also, many companies will want you to use the most expensive oil, so you may not get to truth if you ask a retailer.

The best advice I can give to you, which will be impartial, is to have a look at the link below and I’m sure they will be able to answer all you oil questions."

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/performance_lubricants/recommend_oil.aspx


Pagoda Lilly

mille

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #20 on: June 14, 2006, 13:56:22 »
We use semi-synthetic 10W/40 API SJ oil for our 230 SL, which is fitted a rebuild 280 SL engine with less than 20.000 km. Semi-synthetic oil is based on mineral oil and it's widely believed among owners of older vehicles, that semi-synthetic oil is providing the best from both worlds. So far we haven't had any problems, oil pressure is full even when idling after a long fast run and there are no leaks at all.

Finally summer - happy top down motoring  8)

Finn

1964 230 SL Euro 4-speed manual silver metallic black interior

ChrisInNashville

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Re: What type of motor oil are 113 owners using?
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2006, 17:02:40 »
After purchasing my pagoda two years ago, overnight I went from a small puddle each night (about 20 drips) to 3 drips using Mobil Delvac 5W/40.    

It's been a great success for me; it's a bit of a pain since I can only purchase directly from the distributor.
Tennessee, USA