Author Topic: 230SL WRD Part Dimension  (Read 1443 times)

mistertj

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230SL WRD Part Dimension
« on: September 23, 2020, 21:00:06 »
Related to the WRD disassembly question asked below, does anyone know what the piston and rod assembly length should be. I have the old style long thermostat. Also curious why 2 adjustments...the screw on the top of the piston and shims at the base between the WRD and injection pump.. Last question, can replacement parts for the WRD be obtained anywhere or is the whole assembly purchasable?

Tomnistuff

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Re: 230SL WRD Part Dimension
« Reply #1 on: September 24, 2020, 00:21:44 »
Hello mistertj.

I'm the one who has been discussing the 230SL WRD with Wallace Wheeler.  When I first took my WRD apart, I measured the length of the piston and rod assembly as it was before I decided to take it apart.  I'm not sure there is a given factory length for all WRD rods, but mine was nearly the same as yours, albeit wrong because mine, which looks exactly like yours would shut off the air at 50 degrees C.  Mine measured 66.36 mm from the tip of the rod to the tip of the small black screw, where yours is 66.55 mm.  I finally got it to shut off at 80 degrees C with an adjusted length of 65.20 mm, but that included screwing the small black screw all the way in and correcting the installation of the brass colored hex head dowel on the side of the bore, the problems of which I have been discussing with Wallace Wheeler in the other WRD thread.  The small black screw determined the piston distance from the screw hex and the overall rod length, but the brass colored hex head dowel was restricting the piston and rod travel and delaying contact with the thermostat pin until late in the warmup period.

If you have been following my and Wallace's discussion, you know that I only have one oval shim where you apparently have two that I can see in your photo.

Thank you for your photo.  It has taught me that more than one oval shim means that the oval shims are to adjust the engagement of the end of the rod with the fuel lever inside the pump and controls the amount of fuel to be mixed with the air flowing through the WRD.  According to Joe Alexander (JA17), the bottom of the piston is supposed to shut off the air port when the coolant temperature reaches 80 degrees C, not 50 degrees C like mine was originally.  Once that is correctly adjusted by adjusting the little black hex screw on the piston, if the mixture it too lean or too rich, the air fuel ratio during warmup can be further adjusted by adding or removing oval shims between the WRD and the Pump Body.  Adding oval shims = less fuel lever contact and more fuel during warmup),  Removing oval shims = more fuel lever contact and less fuel during warmup).

Since air flow quantity is a function of coolant temperature controlled by the thermostat moving the piston relative to the air port (lower edge of the piston position vs the bottom edge of the air port in the body) and at the same time, how much the end of the rod pushes on the fuel lever in the pump, the ratio of air to fuel should be almost constant but the quantity of both should be decreasing as the coolant temperature approaches 80 degrees C where the WRD fuel and WRD air both shut off.

I have determined that my rod tip is worn flat by contact with the fuel lever in the pump so to get back to the original engagement with the fuel lever I need to add rod length (not possible), so I will remove housing length (by removing an oval shim - the only one still installed).

So you see, it is normal on the 230SL to have both the little black screw to make the air shut off at 80 degrees C, and the oval shims in a quantity correct to make the correct amount of engagement of the rod tip to the fuel lever in the pump.  If both are correct, then the air fuel ratio as well as the quantity of both fuel and air will be correct during warmup, which ends at 80 degrees C.

I'm sorry for the sermon.  but I felt that almost all of the Pagoda technical discussions in the forum relate to the later cars whose engine characteristics are very similar but critically different than the 230SL.  The Technical Manual is a great help but there were too many things I could not learn relating to my 230SL.  These discussions with you and Wallace have provided little tidbits of information that solve a lot of my problems.  Until your photo, I did not know that the 230SL had more than one oval shim under the WRD, since mine has only one.  Until I took mine apart, I did not know that the brass colored hex head dowel could be improperly installed, completely screwing up the warmup function.  I also did not know that the tip of the rod could be shortened by years of contact with the fuel lever inside the pump requiring oval shim removal to increase rod penetration into the pump.

At some point, these things and probably many more eccentricities of the 230SL engines should be entered into the Technical Manual for 230SLs only.

Let's keep up the 230SL communications.

Tom Kizer
« Last Edit: September 25, 2020, 16:47:04 by Tomnistuff »
Apparently late 1966 230SL 4-spd manual (Italian Version)
Owned since 1987 and wrapping up a full rotisserie restoration/modernization.
Was: Papyrus White 717G with Turquoise MBtex 112 and Kinderseat
Is: Dark Blue 332G with Dark Blue Leather (5300, I think)

mistertj

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Re: 230SL WRD Part Dimension
« Reply #2 on: September 24, 2020, 02:26:09 »
Hi Tom - Thank you for the in depth discussion. It has helped me understand more as well. I will do some more measuring tomorrow to see if any adjusting is needed.
As an aside...I have had a nightmare of very expensive issues with my injection pump which I finally  concluded by installing a different pump but unfortunately not changing the WRD. It was not until I replaced the WRD with the one from the different pump that my problems went away. I'm now wondering if my old injection pump which visited Gus at Pacific Fuel Injection 2 times was just a bad WRD. So I'm wondering if the injection pump rebuilders check the WRD as part of their rebuilds.
Anyway, the car is running great now...idles art about 600 rpm and almost never stalls.
Tom Mackey

Tomnistuff

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Re: 230SL WRD Part Dimension
« Reply #3 on: September 24, 2020, 03:30:45 »
Hi Tom,
You may be right about the WRD not being a part of a rebuild.  Mine was much worse after the IP rebuild.  They rebuilt it for cosmetics reasons after 45 years at my request though it worked well.  I guess it had to be removed and disassembled for plating.  It wasn't as good after rebuild.  Anyway, it should be good now - I hope.

The only time my car has ever idled at 600 rpm is just before it died.

Tom Kizer
Apparently late 1966 230SL 4-spd manual (Italian Version)
Owned since 1987 and wrapping up a full rotisserie restoration/modernization.
Was: Papyrus White 717G with Turquoise MBtex 112 and Kinderseat
Is: Dark Blue 332G with Dark Blue Leather (5300, I think)

mistertj

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Re: 230SL WRD Part Dimension
« Reply #4 on: September 24, 2020, 14:17:00 »
Hi again Tom - Hmmmm! Very interesting...now that I am thinking of it. After the rebuild, I was getting a muffled popping at low constant speed. Someone suggested a manifold air leak. I'm guessing now that it was the WRD not closing completely. Also, my plugs were black maybe from the WRD rod not extending far enough to contact the arm in the injector pump to lean out the fuel mix.
When I got the injector pump back from Pacific, I just couldn't get the engine to not stall below 2000 rpm so I made an internal high speed adjustment which made things better but still not good. In frustration I purchased an advertised rebuilt injection pump on eBay. Since the "rebuilt" pump came with the WRD and solenoid removed for shipping. Foolishly to save time I left the old WRD connected to the water hoses and just screwed it into the "rebuilt" injector pump. The engine preformed a little better but still not great. Since I was going to do some painting of engine components, I drained some coolant and removed the old WRD for cleanup and painting. In it's place, I put the WRD that came with the "rebuilt" unit. After getting most all the painting done that I wanted, started the engine and backed the car out of the garage. Something strange??? The engine was idling nicely. Took it for a test drive...no more popping. I am now one happy camper. The engine is running like it did back in 87' when I bought her. Actually running better...I rebuilt the engine back in 98'...it would smoke at startup and during acceleration. I took the head t a local shop to have a valve job done. While that was gone I did rings and bearings. 
My current challenge is...finding out the specs (measurements) for the WRD to get my old one adjusted back to what it should be. Then maybe sell that pump.
Tom 
« Last Edit: September 24, 2020, 21:24:01 by mistertj »

Tomnistuff

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Re: 230SL WRD Part Dimension
« Reply #5 on: September 25, 2020, 17:10:54 »
Well, I got mine back together yesterday afternoon and did a cold start (at about 16 degrees C ambient temperature).  Everything worked well enough but without the last oval shim, the WRD air flow did not shut completely off.  That doesn't make sense to me.  There was a very slight flow at the WRD air filter fitting hole at the max engine temp which could have been a degree or two cooler than the last fully warmed up temperature, which meant that the piston and shaft did not move down quite as far as before.  Since I'm dealing with tiny fractions of a mm WRD travel, it may be variable from one run to the next.  I had drained and replaced the coolant to do the work on the WRD assembly, so maybe it didn't quite heat up the engine thermostat at the radiator as much the last time.  Or maybe there was air trapped in the WRD thermostat housing.  The engine temperature gauge looked a tiny bit cooler at fully warm.  I didn't drive the car.  Who knows?

A few minutes ago, after all of the above observations, I replaced the last oval shim that I had removed yesterday, and if the problem repeats, I'll just have to back off the small black hex head screw on the piston to get the piston to travel a tiny bit farther to guarantee that the WRD air flow and fuel enrichment really do cut off completely.

Live and learn - hopefully.  It's really good enough now so I should stop and be happy - at least until I start it up again.

Tom Kizer
Apparently late 1966 230SL 4-spd manual (Italian Version)
Owned since 1987 and wrapping up a full rotisserie restoration/modernization.
Was: Papyrus White 717G with Turquoise MBtex 112 and Kinderseat
Is: Dark Blue 332G with Dark Blue Leather (5300, I think)

mistertj

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Re: 230SL WRD Part Dimension
« Reply #6 on: September 25, 2020, 20:56:00 »
Would like to find a drawing like this only for the 230SL with the long thermostat so I could put dimensions on it. Think it would be helpful to others.

Speaking of helpful, here is a 2018 writeup on the early long WRD thermostat.
https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=28351.msg204721#msg204721
« Last Edit: September 25, 2020, 21:03:45 by mistertj »