Soft top bolts

[jan lauwers]

Guys,


I am restoring my soft top frame and I have ordered the set of 14 new bolts for the hinges from Niemueller. (See pic). At arrival I noticed that the thread of these bolts is slightly different to the thread of the old ones. Sounds unbelievable but it is true! I am now told that I should pull a different thread in the holes of the frame legs. I do not see the logic, why a producer who ‘copies’ the old bolts, would make them with a different thread. Anybody who has experienced this?

Thanks gentlemen.

Jan

[chumps]

Jan, I noticed you bought all the short bolts, Are you also replacing the large main hinge bolt? It is about 2 "long. I'm getting ready to take that bolt out now. I believe it is the only bolt I have to remove to correct a problem I have. All my bolts are center punch to keep them from coming loose. Did you have any trouble getting them out? I have done all the work on my car for the last 25 years, but I'm nervous about fooling around with top frame. They are very hard to find and very expensive when you do find one. Completely refurbished ones can coast as much as $10,000. My top and frame are in excellent shape except for that hinge. Thanks for any advice. Chumps

[wayne R]

Jan---Would like to ask,do you still have all your original  bolts, if yes--unless threads are damaged,
they can be restored ,.
I personally would return those bolts, and restore originals,
other wise it will cause other problems  further on to complete the top frame.
Also from your photo, looks like 2 of those new bolts are stainless, others are not.

[DaveB]

I do not see the logic, why a producer who ‘copies’ the old bolts, would make them with a different thread.

I would guess they do not have these bolts made, just buy them off the shelf from another supplier. In my view it's unacceptable for them to sell parts that don't fit.

[DaveB]

And do you mean Niemöller (your text) or SLS (your photo)?

[jan lauwers]

I mean Niemueller, but I took the pic from the SLS site, since NM has no pic.
Best regards
Jan

[hkollan]

Hi,

The soft top bolts I’ve gotten from SLS has been good reproductions of the original
ones they replaced.
As Wayne already pointed out, restoring the original ones are often impossible due to stripped threads etc.
With worn out bolts the threads in the frame itself usually requires fixing as well.

I find it also a bit unfair/lazy to publicly complain about a product using a product picture from a different supplier. 
Why not take a picture of the bolts you bought from NM next to your originals.

Hans K

[jan lauwers]

Hi Hans,

Thanks for your reaction. In my first note I did mention that I bought them from Niemueller. In the meantime, they (NM) have now confirmed that the thread is indeed different and they are discussing the topic with their supplier, so it looks like they are handling the issue in a fair way. Point taken about the SLS pic, I don't know if their bolts have the correct thread.

To Chumps: Yes the long bolt also has the wrong thread.    
Best regards, 

Jan

[Sead]

Hi all,
I just finished reconditioning my soft top frame. All parts have been rechromed and I have made new bolts incl. brass washers.
See pics. I have few sets of bolts for sale as on pictures. Thread is m8x1,25. They fitted my 230SL sorft top frame. But I have seen also m8x1mm, so I was also confused about this. I think if u have m8x1 u can do recut to m8x1,25mm. I have sold few of these bolt kits and got no negative comments on them.
I will put them in for sale section...

[chumps]

Sead - Is there a difference in the mechanism of the earlier top frame hinges verses the later tops? I have a 1971 280 Sl. I have not got mine torn apart but I believe that the brass bushing you show is what I need, Is it common for these bushings to wear enough to hinder the function of the hinge? I can't locate the picture that was in your last thread. I mentioned the bushing in a reply that wrote but I can't find that either. You stated that you had these bushings but it would have to be an order of three sets minimum. Unfortunately I only need 1 set. Are those bushings the same size on all frames? Are they pressed in and out? Can work on the hinge be done with the ragtop mounted on the frame?  Thank you for your help, Chumps

[Sead]

Sead - Is there a difference in the mechanism of the earlier top frame hinges verses the later tops? I have a 1971 280 Sl. I have not got mine torn apart but I believe that the brass bushing you show is what I need, Is it common for these bushings to wear enough to hinder the function of the hinge? I can't locate the picture that was in your last thread. I mentioned the bushing in a reply that wrote but I can't find that either. You stated that you had these bushings but it would have to be an order of three sets minimum. Unfortunately I only need 1 set. Are those bushings the same size on all frames? Are they pressed in and out? Can work on the hinge be done with the ragtop mounted on the frame?  Thank you for your help, Chumps

Pictures and your comment are in "For sale section"  i in my post  here :
https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=31847.0

I guess those brass bushings are same on both frames as bolts fits both. They must be pressed in and out. Im not sure if this can be done with the frame in the car. Furthermore after bushing is pressed in , you need to use adjustable reamer to ensure nice fit of the bolt as diameter of bushing gets smaller when pressed in. Like on all other bushings on this car...
How much a worn bushing affects smooth closing and opening of frame  I dont know, but Im sure for proper overhauling of the frame all bolts incl bushings should be changed. At least I did this on mine and on one of my friend... I will probably let the 3 needed  sets produce... PM for details about payment and shipping.
regards#
Sead

[chumps]

I have asked this question before. What is the best way to get the hinge bolts out that have center punched on the end to keep them from coming loose? I realize you are going to destroy the bolt, but is there a way to get it out without damaging the threads in the frame?

Chumps

[jan lauwers]

Hi Chumps,


I'm not an expert here, but I am currently restoring my soft-top so I’m happy to share my experience.
Since they did not have Loctite some 50 years ago, their method to lock the bolts was indeed to punch the ends like you say. I believe a good way is to file the punched ends off, or better still, to grind it off with a mini grinding mill type Dremel. Be careful not to damage the soft-top arms obviously. This method has worked reasonably well for me...still, I did have to replace some of the bolts by new ones.

Hope this helps a bit... good luck,

Jan

[chumps]

Jan - Thank you for your reply. That is route that I was thinking about taking. I will ask more questions as they come up.

Chumps

[Fred Verboon]

Dear Jan,

May I ask you if there are experts / members that help people that are struggling with the softtop frame?
Looking forward to your reply.

Kind regards, Fred

[Peter van Es]

Fred,

Van Dijk in Lisserbroek. But remember, adjusting it is fiddly work and may take hours. So it won't be cheap.

Peter

[Pawel66]

I tried to replace the bolts in my soft top frame - mine do not look so well any more and have some slack. I knew the bolts were punched so that they do not unscrew easily.

I managed to replace two. There was no way on earth to remove the old ones. Not necessarily those that were secured from unscrewing - also those in blind holes. I dropped the effort, deciding maybe one day, when the top is off the car for some repair.

Also: be careful with the set from SLS. They have 8 bolts 8x1.5mm while the threads you may have are 8x1.0mm. These bolts I bought from the dealer.