What's your thoughts on this Pagoda 280 SL from 1968?

[muminhunter3000]

Hello guys!

I would like some input from you who are good at cars, especially old Pagodas. I think this forum is the right place to be then?

My friend's dad sadly passed away last year and left behind a red Pagoda 280 SL from 1968. It has been in a garage since 1987 and never seen the sunlight since, until now when she has to pass it on to someone. The plan was probably (of course it was…) to restore it, the doors and trunk is painted and that’s about it. The engine was restored by a professional mechanic 10 years ago but is not installed and I have no pictures. I have not seen it myself so I don’t know more details about it. The seats are also with the car but I have no pictures or condition info on them. The hardtop should also be in her possession, but she hasn’t located it yet.

I’ve seen the in car in person and it’s not that much rust underneath, considering it's turing 52 this year. The floor on the driver’s seat is pretty eaten by rust as far as I can tell though.

I’ve been looking online for a fair market value for a similar car but either they are in more or less mint condition ($200,000+) or not even in a condition at all, like: http://topclassiccarsforsale.com/mercedes-benz/548403-1967-mercedes-benz-250sl-pagoda-113-250-sl-project-car-for-parts-or-restoration.html (This one is priced at $12,500).

As far as I understand is the 280 SL the most attractive one, please correct me if I’m wrong?

What’s your thoughts of it? Of course it’s hard judging just by pictures, but I tried making the pictures as honest as possible. 

What’s your opinion on what to do next? What’s a reasonable asking price? Are these car in high demand at the moment?
I’d love to trying to restore it myself but I know how many hours that goes in to a project like this and I have nowhere to do it and all the knowledge yada yada… But I really love the shapes, it’s a classic classic.

We would be grateful to hear your thoughts on the car!
The car is located in south west of Sweden.

Here are some more pictures of it: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/5yx3vw6c0hfi5j7/AAAEA0ZCHXrnVE1Mr7zH0zYOa?dl=0

Best regards

Mattias

[doitwright]

Major project car. I would put it on eBay but only if you can adequately describe everything about the condition and provide photos and a description of the rust issues and what is included. Start the auction at say 9 or 10 K. You can set a reserve but bidding is more competitive with no reserve. You can also post it here for sale. Ask whatever you want. The responses you get will give you an indication of what kind of interest there is. When I sell a car I do not have time for tire kickers and low ball buyers. I describe the car honestly and provide photos of problem areas even if the average buyer would not think to look in those spots. The last car I sold was a 65 220SEb coupe. I put up a website just for that car with a walk around video and lots of photos.

[johnk]

I would pass on it if I were you. The missing parts (which there will be) can cost a fortune if available and you have no road map to put it together. A project car like this is best left to someone who has is experienced with knowing what goes where and has access to spare parts from past projects like JA17 or doctor Benz.

John k

[stickandrudderman]

It looks like a good basis for a long term/part time/enthusiast project but you'll need time, time, missing parts, patience, money, space and more time.
If you have all of those things and you could buy it for 10K then great.
As someone who restores these cars for a living even if I bought it for 5K I'd still struggle to make a profit out of it unless I broke it for parts, in which case there's plenty in it.
So there you have it. My offer is €5000. I'm sure someone will offer you more.

[SEB]

Hello Mattias
The 280SL version is the most valuable Pagoda, but at the moment we have at least in Germany (about 5000 registered Pagodas+ 10% in showrooms or collections) the drop of the prices in the last 5 years  of about -25%. To make this challenge much harder we have from the other side the increase of parts and services costs (also in low cost countries for us in Germany like Czech or Poland).

If you are not familiar with the different details or do have somebody, who can help you it can happen, that the cost spend for the restoration will be much higher, than the current market value.

But if you are determined to restore this beauty full Pagoda, aware that it takes your time and a lot of your money you will find here all necessary information and also people, who for sure will help you with all open questions?  Or give you the necessary advise.

This is the excellent and unique value of this community.

So finally is up to you or more to your heart.

With best wishes from Germany
Sebastian

[john.mancini]

Hi Mattias,

Having restored many "Collector" cars over the years, and having owned many W113 SL's, the one thing I would emphasize is that these beautiful Pagodas are not easy to restore and prohibitively expensive to restore. You mentioned that the car has sat since the 1980's. There's your proof that the restoration came to a screeching halt, probably due the complexity and the cost. Why would you want to take on that money draining project?

I would not buy the car unless you are an expert MB mechanic who has a treasure trove of parts.

John

[Cees Klumper]

Would be a great project for someone who knows what they are doing and does not have to count his or her hours, ie just pay for necessary parts. Would love to tackle something like this myself, after retirement (still a few years away). So best bet is to market it to enthusiast DYI-ers. I would pay to around €15,000 if there is no structural rust and depending on completeness (e.g does it have the soft top frame) if it were me buying.

[Memmo]

Hi,
I have looked at the car.

The Softtop is from 230 SL with wood at the backside.

The right and back fenders are not good inside, is Full with spatula.

The paint look nice but the quality is not good.

The car is standing outside and inside where is no paint it start to rusty.

And the seller is for me not seious.

I was driven more than 300 km because he offer 10 K, than he say he must talk with Petra and can’t decide.

I think he want to look who pay 500 Euro more.

There was no typeplate abd it was not possible to check the VIN number (maybe to many paint).


Memo

[stickandrudderman]

Seems like my offer is a generous one!

[Memmo]

Here you can see how the quality is.

[Memmo]

230 Softtop

[Memmo]

Rust

[Memmo]

The wood after the seats was selfmade.

The injection pump was inside the car in a bag and was rusty. A lot of parts from the engine was in a box, how they restore the engine without the parts?!?

Ask for Detail pics, before somebody buy it.

Downside I dind’t look, because it was wet.

Memmo

[john.mancini]

Over the past couple of years I set out looking for a 230SL with a 4-speed manual transmission. I looked at many that had plenty of issues, the most common being previous serious rust or accident damage. I finally found a 65 230SL that still retained, (in great condition), all of its original body panels, original MB bumpers and original MB glass. Original spare too! Never rusted, never damaged. Brand new interior, detailed engine compartment and so on. My point ?...........look for a car that still retains its original body. Stay away from rusty cars. Unless you own a "soup to nuts" restoration shop, that car will most likely never get fully restored and never see the road. You will spend four or five times what I paid for my 230SL and the experience will be costly and frustrating, to say the least.

Nice cars still exist. The silver and blue 280SL that recently appeared for sale on our website is one example. Although the price is in the $80K range, you'll spend at least double that trying to restore the rusty red car.  It will never be worth the time and expense.

[mbzse]

Here is a candidate 
https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=29414.0

[johnk]

another question to consider is how good is the Chrome. That is a huge expense if many parts need to be re-chromed.

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Hi Mattias,

My recommendation would be to pass on this car and if you own it I would sell it. Then find one that is drivable and enjoy it while you upgrade and or repair what needs to be done.

The shell you have there needs as most everyone mentioned time and more time and endless Euros to bring her back into shape. Why not make a list of all that needs to be purchased on parts include a paint job (they are very pricey) and time you will need to do all that work. This then will help you to make a sound decision.

I know someone that purchasd a project car some years ago then had it refurbished (I estimate he paid short of $20,000- for the project car then well over $100,000- to get it refurbished it took over 4 years, in all that time he could not drive it only visit it).

So if you decide to find something you can enjoy driving while planning mini-projects to do to the car that needs to be done.

Good Luck,

Dieter

[PeterPortugal]

I am loving these comments. That car looks great compared to what I have bought !!

I agree with everybody though....deep pockets are needed.

[muminhunter3000]

Thank you very much all for all your inputs in this topic, both in PMs and here!

Now we know a little more what reasonable to ask for it.

As far as I'm aware it's still not sold, but the hard top is located now. Unknown condition.