UNSOLD CARS .... Are we Pagoda owners adding to it?

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

UNSOLD CARS, Unbelievable .... Did you know so many new cars are being stock piled around the world?

http://www.vincelewis.net/unsoldcars.html

When have you purchased a brand new car the last time ?

My last brand new one was in 2011

From the approx 30 cars I've owned only 6 or 7 were brand spanking new, the rest were slightly used ones (except for my Pagoda).

[66andBlue]

The last time I bought a brand new car was in 1982, a Chevy S10 with the extended cab; worst car i ever had!
Since then I have always bought cars that were about 12 - 18 months old.

For me the most eye-catching line/photo  in this article is this one:
Sales are down because the peasants have less cash to spend as the wealthy have been siphoning it all off over the past decade or so.

[Cees Klumper]

Last I bought a new car was 1995. Now I buy cars that are about 7 years old with very low mileage. I then keep them for at least 10 years. As an accountant I can tell you from experience it's loads cheaper as they are about 75% cheaper to buy and only maybe 10% more expensive to operate over that timeframe.

[enochbell]

Last new car was 2008, an Audi my wife drives, went to trade in on a new Honda this weekend and was offered about 25% of its original value.  Ouch.  For my driving needs I have NEVER bought a new car.  Now driving a 2004 MB I purchased in 2008 with 19,000 miles for $60,000 less than the original price.  No-brainer.

As for the article about the new car glut I am afraid it is a lot of sensationalist bunk.  The author is a self -admitted conspiracy theorist.  Weather issues did slow sales this spring and inventory is heavy but production is still being maintained apace in anticipation of a catchup in new car purchases this summer.  This author is more about bashing the wealthy than checking his facts.

g

[scoot]

First of all, I think the link is a load of crap:
"Yes I'm also an author and my book on conspiracy theories has no correlation whatsoever with this webpage."
Get out the tinfoil hat...

My "normal" cars present and past:

2002 Mercedes C230 kompressor bought new
2007 Prius bought new
2 Ford Rangers and 2 Toyota pickups from 1995 - 2005 bought new  (all loss-leaders)
2010 VW Jetta bought as a 2 year old CPO car in 2012 with 13000 miles on it

[Flyair]

My last three cars were bought new:
a Toyota Land Cruiser in 2006 (still using)
a Chrysler Voyager (Town&Country in US) in 2008 (disposed of)
a MB GL in 2011 (still using)

My Pagoda was bought in 2009, a 38 years old lady then. Today, at 43 she is as new (or in some aspects even better than new:))
    

[49er]

Only two used cars, my 1st car, a 1930 model A Ford coupe and my 2nd car, a 1956 Ford. Everything else, including my 2 Pagodas, New. Currently a 1997 Grand Caravan (which is lucky to accumulate 500 miles a year), a 2000 Toyota Camry and a 2010 Camry hybrid. We do seem to hang onto cars for a while but my wife/navigator has been eyeing photos of the new C class. Uh Oh.

John

[ghenne]

The original story quoted in this thread is nonsense.

http://jalopnik.com/that-zero-hedge-article-on-unsold-cars-is-bullshit-1578124255

That being said, the average age of my cars is 34.  :-)

[mdsalemi]

Rolf,

We Pagoda Owners--I'm assuming you are speaking of those participating in this forum, are but a small subset of the forum's members. I would suggest that the majority of forum members don't actively participate. However, even considering all of the forum members, active or not, we're just a small subset of those Pagoda owners around the world. I would not think that what we do or don't do, amounts to much of anything relative to new automobile purchases! For some time recently (this has alleviated just a small amount) finding good used cars was difficult. As has been noted, people are holding on to them longer, so finding a 1-3 year old car without a lot of miles might be challenging. I had a hard time finding one for my father, but eventually did; at age 91 he didn't want a new car, but "settled" for a 2-year old car with 12,000 miles. It wasn't easy to find.

George,

Thanks for that jalopnik post. Speaks to the truth!

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

Gentlemen,

I do hope I did not hurt anyone's feelings here, when I typed .... "Are we Pagoda owners adding to it?" ... I simply meant it as a joke

As for the link, I found it amusing and just wanted to share it.

I do think however that at one time or another the cars in the various pictures displayed have indeed been Unsold Cars if only for a short while. No automobile manufacturer would remain in business very long if they would produce cars and stockpile them as it is referred to in the original link.

As for the article in the original link I like to add that I've long learned not to believe everything that is written.

Should I have offended anyone here in posting the original link .... Please accept my apology.

[49er]

No apology needed here.  I understood your comment to be "tongue in cheek". I found the aerial photos interesting as well and it is really amazing that many cars were parked for whatever reason!

John

[Rolf-Dieter ✝︎]

That being said, the average age of my cars is 34.  :-)

Gosh you do like old cars my neighbor Hartmut told me about a individual in Toronto being in real-estate that owns a nice Pagoda for the longest time, I'm wondering if you might be that individual seeing that you are a member here since 2003.

[mdsalemi]

I do hope I did not hurt anyone's feelings here, when I typed .... "Are we Pagoda owners adding to it?" ... I simply meant it as a joke

You DID uncover some pretty revealing information, since most people who responded [here] are not buying new cars!
At my house, the 1969 Mercedes shares a garage with a 2014 Taurus SHO and banished now, to the driveway is the other 2014 Ford…
Guess we're a bit newer than most around this forum. Last summer, for one brief, shining moment (that means just overnight) even the Taurus was banished to the driveway…I promised Mercedes-Benz that the new S-Class they brought [for display at Concours of America] would be properly garaged!   Had to give it back the next morning...
(and not likely that a real one will ever take its place--just borrowed!  )

[66andBlue]

... Should I have offended anyone here in posting the original link .... Please accept my apology.

Heya R-D,
there is no need to apologize, you didn't write the article! 

[ejboyd5]

The original story quoted in this thread is nonsense-article-on-unsold-cars-is-bullshit-That being said, the average age of my cars is 34.

This post got me thinking and I did a quick analysis that the CPA would appreciate.  Of my dozen vehicles, the average age is 41.08 years.  Only three were bought new by my parents ('61 300 SL, '64 220 SEb and '72 280 SE 4.5), all the rest were acquired at various stages in their lives like the '55 300 SL Coupe I got in 1964. Newest vehicle is a 2006 Dodge Ram.  I would never buy new today!

[mdsalemi]

I would never buy new today!

It's all a "well balanced system."

We need people to buy new cars, since they don't "make" used cars. We also need people to buy used cars, as there has to be a place for those who buy new to sell their "used" cars.

From an accounting perspective (heaven help us all if every decision was made with an accountant's perspective) you get the best value when a chunk of the asset's depreciation has happened; thus buying a car with a few years under the belt. That doesn't always work, however, for people who want to have the latest and greatest!

Most of the time we have a nice balance, when we don't you have some notable price fluctuations…such as "incentives" from the manufacturers, or used car prices going up. Dealers around here were clamoring for trade ins around 2008-2012 as their inventory of used cars was nil.

Cars not used as daily drivers shouldn't be a factor in the suggestion of new cars piling up. Many of the cars in people's stables around here are not daily drivers, but collectibles.

[Cees Klumper]

I did a quick analysis that the CPA would appreciate.

The CPA appreciates ... 

[Cees Klumper]

heaven help us all if every decision was made with an accountant's perspective

What on earth do you mean?! 

[thelews]

Last new car I bought was a '91 Capri when I sold my MGB because I needed a backseat with seatbellts for my little kids.  Since then, I've only bought used cars.  For a while, while funds were used for things other than cars, i'd buy Cadillacs for $6K drive them 3 or so years and sell them for $3K.  Talk about cheap, luxury transportation!  Then I gradually moved up the ladder to my more recent purchace of a 2006 SL500 in 2012 with 28K miles, practically brand new from CarMax for $38K.  That's almost a 100K sticker car for a 60% discount that was barely broken in.  And, I was able to purchase a 6 year, 100k mile warranty from CarMax. I love the car.  My most recent purchase is a 65K mile Audi A6, 2003, for $5K.  With 4WD and heated seats, it's perfect for winter.

IMO, the sweet spot for pre-owned is three to four years old, 25-45K miles.  CarMax has quite an operation in this market, I and others have been very pleased with.  Friend just bought a 2011 BMW 550XI there with ALL the bells and whistles, 35K miles, in spectacular shape for $42K.  What was that new?  70K+?  Let someone else eat the steep slope of depreciation.

[ghenne]

Gosh you do like old cars my neighbor Hartmut told me about a individual in Toronto being in real-estate that owns a nice Pagoda for the longest time, I'm wondering if you might be that individual seeing that you are a member here since 2003.

I'm a software guy, not in real estate.

A couple more perspectives:

My accountant used to have a green pagoda. He sold it within a year or two. It was not an exciting asset to him. Could have been the automatic transmission or because accountant.

We do buy a new Mercedes ML diesel every few years and work it to death. It's the family mover and is in constant motion. We get the extended warranty and put 30,000 km a year on it. Not much goes wrong, but the cost of the extended warranty is covered by just two unexpected repairs. These cars are getting so complex that fixing them when they get older is horrendous. We get rid of the car when the reliability or the warranty ends, whichever comes first. It's not the cheapest solution, but reliability is a higher priority.

[mdsalemi]

These cars are getting so complex that fixing them when they get older is horrendous.

On our recent MBCA Tech Session held at Motorwerks in Commerce Twp, MI, we heard the story of one of their conversions: fitting a 6.0L V12 into a late model SLK. The challenge was not in the fitting, or the cooling, or any physical issues like that; it is the fact that there are ~38 ECU modules (basically, computers) that control everything on the car. As a software guy George, you will note that nearly all of these modules are flashed with the original VIN number, so they cannot be taken from one car and put into another. They all talk to one another! Some modules had to be "virginized" (their words); others had to be replaced; others had to be re-flashed. What needed to be done to each module to make the car work "as a system" depended on the module. They don't exactly scream at you what's wrong…they show you in bizarre ways, like the engine not starting, directionals not working, cooling fan always on, or something like that. It was a 2-year iterative process to sort it all out. BTW it's all done and this little SLK (imagine this in the capable driving hands of Joe Alexander!) features over 600HP.

As you said, these cars are getting very complex!