door glass removal... spring question

[BaronYoungman]

I am removing the door glass to put in guide... I cant get the 4 bolts to loosen I think they are stripped.  I was wondering, can I just remove the 2 bolts that hold on the front lift and then from the back lift remove the clip that holds in that lift (it feels like a c clip).  If I do not unhinge the spring will the two lifts then come flying, or will it be ok as there is tension both up and down from the mechanism teeth?
Thanks, Bob

[66andBlue]

Bob,
which bolts give you trouble?The ones circled in red here?



This photo is from the wiki, have you read the removal procedure?
http://www.sl113.org/wiki/ChassisBody/Windows#Adjustment

[BaronYoungman]

yes cant get those out so I was thinking of taking these out and lifting the entire glass and metal track out so I can reglue the guide in.

[waltklatt]

Yes, the later picture is better.
Undo the circlip spring on the rear and the two 10mm bolts on the front.  That way you can slip the glass back to the near original position.

Walter
1967 220SL diesel

[BaronYoungman]

BUT do I need to disconnect the spring?  I don't want the arms flying up
Bob

[66andBlue]

Bob,
here is a photo showing the clip from the back - might not be easy to remove "blind". But even if you can get the glass together with both rails off I am not sure that you can lift the assembly out on top since it may be too thick. Plus you have to tilt the glass to get it out.  
However, I am puzzled why you have a problem removing the Philips screws. They thread into a retaining bar on the other side of the glass and if either the screw or the threads in the bar are stripped you should be able to get them out. Are the adjuster buffers/limiters still there on two of the screws?

I believe that the spring needs to be removed. You might study the second photo and then decide. 

[waltklatt]

Bob,
No you don’t need to disconnect the spring.
Leave it as it is, and undo the 2 10mm bolts and the circlip.  Glass should come right out if you remove all the windlace felt strips, chrome trim and clips on the top of the door.
Walter
1967 220SL diesel

[BaronYoungman]

OK I got it but just in case someone ever runs into same problem,
1. You do not need to remove spring it is not under tension from the window.
2. My door had small 10MM nuts welded (possible original ) to the back (inside) window piece these had come loose and were just spinning when I was trying to get out the 4 8MM bolts that were holding the glass.  I used my very dexterous wife's small hands to hold the nuts and then I removed the bolts and the glass came out.
Bob

[66andBlue]

Bob,
I am glad you got the glass out .. but did you take it out together with the two retaining rails?
Also I am quite sure that the 10mm welded nuts on your backside retaining bar are NOT original. On the 230SL window lifter there are 4 Philips lens head screws (p/n 007985 005140) and on the 280SL they were replaced by 4 hexhead screws (p/n 00933 005071) 5mm x 20mm long - for sure not the 8mm diameter bolts that you found. The retaining bars (p/n113 720 0147/0247 left/right) are the same for both models.

Walt,
have you taken out the glass together with both retaining rails still attached?
I am asking because when I restored my 230SL the back rail was baked onto the glass and I tried to remove both together. This rail is rectangular and about 5-8mm thick almost as wide as the the slot on top. In my case also the jaw guides were still attached to the glass and it was impossible getting it out. Using a solvent the softened the old rubber/plastic strip and warming it up with a hair dryer I could finally separate the sandwich and remove the glass.

[BaronYoungman]

I took out just the glass with back rail still attached, so I do not know. 
Bob

[waltklatt]

Alfred,
I have taken the glass out several times with the rails still attached.
It is a matter of tilting and angling the glass with channels out of the door.
You can remove the guides inside the door, as in my case I needed to do that because the two metal guides on the glass had come off. (These are famous for falling off)
Baron,
Congrats on getting it out.  And lucky you, with a good and patient wife.
Wish mine were patient like yours.

Walter
1967 220SL diesel

[waltklatt]

Oh and Baron,
There are small rubber rings and small plastic cylinders that fit into the holes of the glass, that are sandwiched between the metal channels.
Save them and reuse them again.
Dont forget, or, when you tighten the 8mm bolts and phillips screws the glass will crack.

Walter
1967 220SL-diesel