Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Body, interior, paint, chrome, and cosmetic items => Topic started by: 66andBlue on September 29, 2011, 02:04:04
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About 4 months ago Andy "Drewtee" posted here: http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=14653.0
"I was wondering if there was enough interest on this forum to source a company to manufacture a near replica of the original firewall pad?" and the response was very much positive.
Since then a few of us – Garry Marks, Tom Colitt (from Classic Autos LA), Dave Gallon (Gallon Restorations) and I - took up the challenge and attached is our summary of this effort.
Where are we at this point?
The old stock firewall material has been delivered to the die maker for cutting out the new pads and by the end of next week we should be able to provide detail photos of the parts in a set.
What will a set cost?
It has always been our goal to provide a product for our members (but not for the general public) that would be in line with the prices that commercial vendors ask for the current jute-backed replacement pads and we are very hopeful that we can stay close to this target. However, we need to wait until the prototypes are finished and tested before we can announce the final price, but we do hope to ship out the first pre-paid sets in about 3 - 4 weeks.
We have written the attached summary describing the rationals and reasons that guided the development of this new product that we have created. If you are interested in purchasing a set of the newly replicated firewall pads then we urge you to read the attached description and afterwards, if you are still keen to buy a set (or two), please reply to this thread again.
We welcome your comments, and please, feel free to ask questions.
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Id buy a set for my lhd 1970 280sl. Mine does have a foam backing currently
Thanks for the detailed hard work!
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Hi Alfred,
Nice work by you and all the others involved. As we recently discussed I have recommenced my pagoda search. The cars I see often have the reproduction leather grain material so in anticipation I would like to be added to the list and would like two (2) LHD pads. Based upon the expected release timing I may be the only buyer without a car but better to be safe than sorry.
Thanks
Chris
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That's TOP TOP work chaps. Brilliant and a great summary of where we are and how you got here.
I am not sure how much material you have or what your reproductive capacities are/will be but I find myself wanting an RHD set (both sides of the firewall) simply to support the initiative! :o
Thanks!
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Richard's Ole Beige needs a new firewall pad...the one in the car now looks like painted tar...no real surface texture and not much backing. I'd post a photo but I don't want viewers to get sick at the sight of the pathetic excuse for a pad. Those who were at PUB were polite enough not to laugh.
The car is a LHD Euro model so a cut-out for the Firewall ID plate would be a nice plus.
Here is my official sign-up for one Pad, please.
Question:
Will a limited skill amateur be able to remove the old pad and install the new without special tools? or does this mean a visit to the auto shop?
Richard M, NYC
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Richard
Alfred and David did have a discussion about possibly having an assembly tool and asked Tom and I our feelings on the subject. Tom and I believed that anyone that could fit the existing after market pads could fit the replicated OEM pad that has been developed.
However, Alfred and Dave looked at a possible way that could simplify the process and whilst still under discussion at this point, may well be written into some instructions to be included. As a minimum, I believe anyone with minor maintenance skills would be able to put the pad together and on the vehicle. Anyone that has reservations on their skills could easily have a restorer or upholsterer fit it for them.
Garry
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I'm ready whenever they are available.
1966 230
Any added instructions will be welcomed!
Norm
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I would like to purchase a set for my 230Sl
George Desiderio
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Count me in for 1 LHD set.
(I wouldn't mind a piece of 1 foot by 1 foot also if possible. I want to try repair before replacement. But I will buy the full set too.)
Thank you for all your hard work !!
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Alfred, one thing I am not clear on.
Is this diamond pattern material you found something that is currently being produced and readily available or is a one time purchase item?
Will we be able to have a continuous supply or one shot?
Thanks
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Dear Garry, Tom, Dave and Alfred,
Thank you so much for your superb effort, hard workon this and brilliant outcome. I could not praise your efforts more than I do.
Please count me in for two LHD sets.
And I would also like to have some "by the meter" (non pre-cut) for the under-dash insulation.
Thanks a lot!
Achim
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Hi All,
Kudos for the effort and the resulting much anticipated product. Count me in. I'd recommend Paypal for easy transaction.
Andy M.
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Thank you Garry, Tom, Alfred and Dave for all your efforts in putting this together. You can definitely put me down for a LHD set for my 230SL.
Marcus
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Count me in for a set for LHD.
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.... Will we be able to have a continuous supply or one shot? ....
Hello Rick,
no, it is not something that is currently produced on a recurring basis. We do have enough material for the current production run and most likely for a second (on a purchase reserve). That also includes sufficient material for perhaps 25 sets (both sides) of the inside firewall pads - they are quite large as you know. We should have sufficient scrap from this run to satisfy any demands for the strips in the trunk floor board.
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... Will a limited skill amateur be able to remove the old pad and install the new without special tools? or does this mean a visit to the auto shop? ...
Hi Richard,
be very careful when Garry tells you "Tom and I believed that anyone that could fit the existing after market pads ... " , you are following the advise of two completely fearless individuals who had no hesitation driving a small moving space on 4 wheels across the continent! ;) ;D
Seriously, what you need to consider is that you have to dismantle quite a bit of plumbing and electrical connections along the firewall, that is, outflow hose from the heater, hood release cable, grounding wires, tach and speedo drive cables and oil pressure tubing, etc.
As a reminder, take a look here:
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=14653.0;attach=11658;image
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=14653.0;attach=12158;image
If doing all of that is no problem for you then you will have no problem with the installation of the new pad.
Since your Euro 280SL needs the VIN cut out it requires that you first remove the demarcated rectangle in the felt backing before removing the release paper. Then you carefully place the felt backing over the front layer (the one with the waffle pattern) - or the front layer on to the sticky side of the felt layer whatever you prefer - and align them before gluing both parts together by pressure. Now you cut out the rectangle in the front layer to create the opening for the VIN plate. Then the completed pads (large one the passenger side and small one on the driver side) can be glued on to the cleaned metal. I would not recommend using a spray adhesive unless you carefully mask off all the areas around the firewall. A good brush on glue is easier to work with and less messy, imo.
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I install the small part first because there are enough places to help you to keep it straight. The large section is a bit more difficult and it's easy to get it wrong. I use a piece of waxed paper between the pad and the firewall and then it can be pulled aside once you have the pad positioned correctly.
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Not to rain on anybody's parade but I just received and email from a california parts outfit that has faithfully copied the old insulating pad pattern. The pad has a adhesive on it already and runs for about 250.00.
Well i guess I came late on this subject. I see there were other strings mentioning the new pad. I hope everyone can get the pad they like best for a price that they feel is fair.
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Count me in for one LHD set.
(250, early, European)
Thanks,
Petri
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Also, as if several different reproductions of the same item isn't enough, I have just received very reliable information that Apple is coming out with an iPad 6 specifically for the Pagoda. It will feature a full vehicle width touchscreen through which owners will be able to identify and repair any problems in their Pagoda just by opening the hood and while driving this plus additional information will be mirrored onto the windshield. Unfortunately the price for the 1kb version (don't forget, this was a lot in 1969) will be around $499, but it will include Wifi and an APP. that installs your hard top as soon as your garage door closes.
On a different note, we have also received the same "email" that "menesesjesse" has received and have determined that the faithfulness of the other mats that have made a mad rush to market, ever since they heard about the Pagoda groups efforts, leaves much to be desired, at a cost that is significantly higher than what our German Meister, Alfred, has in mind. Those of you who know my almost fanatical attention to detail, will appreciate that I was incredulous that he was able to attain not only the same pattern, but also the exact same base material and properties that the original pads had. I know this because I was heavily involved in this process and spent many hours discussing these details with the G4. I made a bit of a concession with the felt backing that is now being offered and I am still confidant that we will also be able to provide the foam backing, if there is a demand for complete authenticity in both appearance and function.
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Great work guys. I particularly like the 7-page illustrated story about the whole process.
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Also, as if several different reproductions of the same item isn't enough, I have just received very reliable information that Apple is coming out with an iPad 6 specifically for the Pagoda. It will feature a full vehicle width touchscreen through which owners will be able to identify and repair any problems in their Pagoda just by opening the hood and while driving this plus additional information will be mirrored onto the windshield. Unfortunately the price for the 1kb version (don't forget, this was a lot in 1969) will be around $499, but it will include Wifi and an APP. that installs your hard top as soon as your garage door closes.
On a different note, we have also received the same "email" that "menesesjesse" has received and have determined that the faithfulness of the other mats that have made a mad rush to market, ever since they heard about the Pagoda groups efforts, leaves much to be desired, at a cost that is significantly higher than what our German Meister, Alfred, has in mind. Those of you who know my almost fanatical attention to detail, will appreciate that I was incredulous that he was able to attain not only the same pattern, but also the exact same base material and properties that the original pads had. I know this because I was heavily involved in this process and spent many hours discussing these details with the G4. I made a bit of a concession with the felt backing that is now being offered and I am still confidant that we will also be able to provide the foam backing, if there is a demand for complete authenticity in both appearance and function.
Tom,
I also received the same email as I imagine a number of people did. Early reports are that his stuff is junk and now I see you saying it's spot on. Not sure what to think but price is always a strong factor for some people and if the newer '' new '' stuff is less that should help sales.
Anyway, it all takes effort so I'm hoping it works out well for everyone.
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Bloody great work, well done the four of you.
The enthusiam from Garry to get this organised from the offset has been quite remarkable, but a big thanks to everyone that has put in the effort and got the final result - Amazing how quickly it has come to fruition.
The knowledge and enthusiasm from certain individuals has produced a great result - what a fab forum this is.
Now, please put me down for enough material for at list one firewall ( RHD) Mine goes to the paint shop next week so the timing is spot on ;)
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This effort has been outstanding from the start. From the attention to detail, to the speed of execution, it's been great to witness the progress. We even got to vote during the decision-making process! Quite an achievement. Thank you Alfred, Garry, Tom and Dave!
Please sign me up for (at least) one set for a LHD 230SL, plus misc pieces for trunk floor and under dash. Now I can't wait to get my car to the paint shop!
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..... a california parts outfit that has faithfully copied the old insulating pad pattern. .....
Hi Jesse,
take a look at this comparison. Which surface pattern is more "faithful" to the original?
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Here's my original
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John,
In my initial quest for the holy grail, I collected together four original pieces of firewall pad that members had sent me. All were more than 40 years old and all had clearly been washed, wiped, subjected to heat, oil and what ever else gets thrown up from road use over the years.
At PUB Alfred gave me a piece of material that he had found in a roll and it was subject to much discussion between Tom and I as we spent 4 days in a small space together driving back to LA. Tom was absolutely convinced that it was some of the original material. I was somewhat sceptical that it was not the right material. It did not have a shine like all my 40 year old samples had and like your photo shows.
In LA Tom showed me the OEM firewall pad that had never been installed on a vehicle. We measured Alfreds sample, played with it and treated the sample to high heat to see what it would do.
No pictures or sample that I had matched the OEM pad or Alfred's sample that matched the OEM pad. Quite simply, I had always assumed that the 40 year old bits that I had were representative of what a new pad would look like. I had spent many hours with a supplier in Melbourne Australia trying to match to the old pieces with what I was able to get out of Asia. Benzrestorers pictures show that he also got what appears to be a match to the pattern on a different material base. I, and I now believe Benzrestorer, were both trying to match what is a 40year old patina and had misunderstood what an original one was really like. A bit like putting vinyl based imitation distressed leather into a car to make it look like it is 40 years old!
However after seeing Alfred's piece and then the OEM original unused pad, I realised that Alfred had found the original material to match. I stopped my Asian search and Alfred proceeded with his material. A wipe with a dash board type cleaner/restorer will soon give it the "older" look if wanted
Here is a photo of Alfred's sample and Toms original pad on the right. The photo does not quite do it full justice, the indentations/raised parts are much more distinct in real life. It just does not have the shine of old age and oil and polishing and cleaning and heat etc etc
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Here are a couple of pictures of my original firewall pad, one taken 6 months after I took delivery which shows a bit of a shine and a closeup I took a few minutes ago. Hope they might be useful. I have to admire all the hard work you folks have put into this project.
John
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Hello John (theLews) and John (49er),
thanks for your pictures - you do have nice original firewall pads indeed! In addition, as I wrote in my report, we do have an original replacement pad sold by Mercedes in 1974 that was never installed. So we have a direct comparison of materials that were never exposed to engine heat, oil fumes, dressing polish, you name it.
John L.
Here is my response to the question that you asked in the other thread (http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=15382.0):
Question, this new member developed pad being qualified for Concours competition...where is there marque specific (113) Concours competition where this kind of detail really comes into play? And, yes, I'm aware many guys just want it for personal satisfaction.
I am sure you know of Tom Hanson, perhaps you met him personally. Here are photos where he and two other distinguished judges inspect Tom LeClerc's car at the Newport Beach Concourse. As the result demonstrates they had no problem accepting the firewall pad that Tom installed in his restored car as "original". This was not an isolated incidence as Tom Colitt can attest to with his restorations. Perhaps you might advise the Black Forest crew when you visit there that a Concourse-level firewall pad is available should they need one.
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I wish to congratulate the team on this remarkable effort!
I would like to order a set for my LHD 1968 280sl, with some scrap pieces for the trunk!
I am VERY excited!!!!
Carsten
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I am in for a LHD pad and trunk pieces.
Also, depending on price and availablity, I might be interested in inside firewall material also.
Thanks,Niko
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Thanks for the responses.
Attached is a picture of the most original pad I can show. It's under the driver's floor mats, no heat, no oil, no water, etc, but, yes, it could have been wiped or vacuumed over the years during an occasional repair or maintenance. Use it for what it's worth.
Yes, I know Tom Hanson, have met him and talked with him on several occassions, most recently last week. Nice fellow.
My point about concours competition was that in multi-marque competition there is not the level of specificity from the judges that you get down to in marque specific competition. It's just not possible, judges can't have the kind of knowledge about many different cars to that level of detail. I appreciate the level of detail you guys are going to with this reproduction, it's a good thing and good to have available when you finish. AND, I would not begrudge you to make a few bucks for your efforts, you should, you worked hard. There's no law that says someone making an effort to produce something well for a club or car shouldn't make a couple of bucks. No one has to buy your product if they don't like the price.
That tangent aside, my point was that I'm not aware of a 113 specific concours judging. This club does not provide it, like the 190 SL Group, Corvette, Jaguar XKE (to name a few), and I'm not aware of any other. The details of your pad become more relevant in that kind of judging, just like screw type and finish, carpet weave, clamps, hoses, etc. And even then the level of knowledge is overwhelming covering all the changes from 63-71.
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No, there isn't 113-specific judging, but there is MBCA judging which covers the 113. There is a broad, "umbrella" decree on that, but the overall judging standard is "as delivered". Original, replaced with MB part (even if it differed from original) will be preferable to the current models (they are not reproductions) available from, say, Miller's where mine came from. Where the new one, or Babak's will fit in, I'm not sure. Perhaps Peter Lesler might weigh in on his opinion here.
The efforts that people go through in this club will be useful perhaps, in the future if a 113-specific concours judging standard is ever written--for this group or for the MBCA or for the German Pagoda group. Maybe the latter already has a judging standard. The detail of the pad, and the level of effort that this team (Garry, Alfred, Tom and who else?) went through is relevant and useful, regardless of whether there is a judging standard on the car. It makes, or will make, another very visible part of an engine bay that much closer to the way it looked when new.
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I am still interested in buying two LHD firewall pads, as prevously stated in the old thread.
Hans
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Alfred:
Will you provide a separate thread to order these or should we reserve them on this one?
Thanks
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Thank you, Hans and Rick.
Not to worry, we'll collect the requests here and when the time comes will notify everyone about the details and also place the description and the actual ordering information into the "For Sale" board where it belongs.
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Perhaps you might advise the Black Forest crew when you visit there that a Concourse-level firewall pad is available should they need one.
Hello Alfred
I hope all interested member orders will be filled before these pads are offered to outside commercial concerns like Black Forest.
Gus
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Hi Gus,
Alfred is away this weekend so I wil answer the question,
Our intent is to fill all Forum orders for LHD units first, plus orders from the German Pagoden forum before we then working on the RHD needs. It will be a once off supply to each of the groups. Anyone , including Black Forrest should register on the forum and put their name down for their needs, however there will most likely be a limit of two initially for each person. Any commercial enterprise wanting more will need to negotiate with a commercial vendor after the initial issue..
Once that is done we are planning to hand it all to several reliable/reputable commercial sources for any follow on requirements from that point. The final distributers are still to be decided at this time.
Pricing initially for the above groups will be based on the recovery of costs that have been incurred. When handed to the commercial sources, I guess good old supply and demand will then set the price.
Garry
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OK, I'll order two LHD sets and would take three if possible.
I would also like a set of the under dash pieces for LHD and a set of the trunk pieces.
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The early 230SL did not have the access plug for the heater core valve. Can you make these fire wall mats with no cut out for that heater core?
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Please add me to the list. 1 x LHD '65.
Thanks for the hard work Alfred, Garry, Tom and Dave G.
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Hi JohnS.
Alfred will answer your query when he returns Monday as he is the one that has been dealing with the die cutting.
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I too would like a set for a left-hand-drive. I would also like to know whether the underdash and trunk pieces will be available, or perhaps bulk material to make them.
Tom Kizer
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Hi Tom,
We are positive that there will be material off cuts in the die cutting process and that these will be available. How big and how much is still unknown at this point as we are just concentrating on getting the supply of the Left Hand pads and backing ready, then working on the Right Hand pads before looking at what else can be done before handing over to the commercial vendors.
So to put it simply, yes there will be some surplus material for other parts of the car but how to and who should distribute it has not been decided.
Garry
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I would also appreciate being on the list. Late model 280SL, LHD. Two would be nice.
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I am interested in a LHD set for 1971 280 SL. Many thanks.
Lakis Akylas
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I would also be interested in a set for LHD 1971 280 Sl and other pieces for the rest of the car. Thanks for you hard work.
Chumps
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Hi Gary,
Please put me down for a RHD.
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Hi,
Please put me down for one LHD set, 66 230sl.
Thanks
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The early 230SL did not have the access plug for the heater core valve. Can you make these fire wall mats with no cut out for that heater core?
John,
in principle we could, but that would require that you would have to pay for the die since this is a 1-part pad, totally different from the later 2-part pad that we are offering.
But I am not sure why you even would want to do this. The pad on very early 230SL cars - about the first 200- 300, nobody really seems to know the exact change date - has a very different surface, nothing like the diamond/waffle pattern of all the subsequent ~45,000 cars. See attached photo.
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Hello Alfred
I see these are being made available to the German group (?). Are we getting anything from them? I would love one of their grill badges.
Gus
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Quote Garry:
Hi All,
Am still looking for a RHD firewall pad pattern taken from either an original one someone is removing or from a reproduction one that someone still has but not yet fitted??
Garry
Are you still looking for this Garry as Kevin O'keefe in the UK I( Ace Trimmer) has a template and can also get them cut (at a reasonable cost)
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Hi Alfred ,I am ready when you are ,thanks for your hard work and thinking of me,
PS there is a new and improved product on te market .The first product was bad the 2nd was better the most recent is the best to date.I am hoping yours will be correct and the best of all !
Best regards.
Tony LaBella
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Hi Alfred,
If this is a 1 or 2 time event,I will take 3 for the 1st group,if the quality is good more the 2nd group and will continue if mre are produced,all LHD.
Thanks,
Tony LaBella
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.... I see these are being made available to the German group (?). Are we getting anything from them? I would love one of their grill badges. ...
Gus,
we do not get anything from any one, and in addition the Pagodentreff.de group never had a badge , as far as I know.
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We would like to purchase one set for our '66 230SL LHD.
Thank you for the effort.
I would like to note that because of this we immediately signed up as full members.
Dave Opko
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Alfred,
please put me down for one LHD.
Peter
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All: Speaking for the MBCA National Concours Committee, the repacement pads that were made up from the material that MBUSA formerly sold is the only pad, other than carefully preserved ones that are acceptable for concours judging at this time.
The verdict will be out on the new pads when we actually see them.
If the old pads material sold by the roll, is no longer available and MBUSA no longer offers any replacements, then the MBCA Concours Committee will probably accept the new version as produced by the SL113 group the de-facto standard replacement.
I hope that answers the question of it's authenticity.
Pete Lesler
MBCA National Concours Committee Chair
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Alfred,
My car is number 671 so it does have the diamond pad as you are making. The only difference on my car is that there is no access cut out for the heater core valve. I do believe mine originally was a 2 part pad also. Can you make a two part pad with the diamond pattern without the cutout for the heater core?
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John,
both the small and the large part of the pad contribute to the opening for the valve access hole. In order to eliminate that we will have to buy two new dies since the contours are different.
Only thing that we could do is to give you some extra material and you cut out a "plug" to fill the opening.
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Hi, Alfred,
Could you please put me down for 1 x LHD and associated material to do the area in the footwells (happy to take advice on how much, etc). Depending on price, I may take 2, but definitely one!
Many thanks,
JH
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Hi, Alfred,
One each firewall pads LHD/RHD + any interior pieces that become available.
Thanks
Naj
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The early 230SL did not have the access plug for the heater core valve...
Not to thrown a spanner in the works here, but the firewall was changed from chassis number 042 004350 (about June 1964) for the 230SL's to have the rubber access plug for the heater valve.
I suppose the demand for cars with chassis numbers earlier as quoted above would be far fever than the later cars with the access plug and a good compromise, as Alfred suggested, would be to cut your own to fill the gap...
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Can you put me down for a LHD with extra materal for the plug and trunk. Thanks John
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The original ones are now available! I installed mine in about 2 hours today....taking my time, removing my "new" pad and glue....making a few needed cuts, etc. I love it...feel like my "perfect" car is more complete and authentic now.
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The original ones are now available! I installed mine in about 2 hours today....taking my time, removing my "new" pad and glue....making a few needed cuts, etc. I love it...feel like my "perfect" car is more complete and authentic now.
Hi Smiledoc (I'm sorry. At first, I was led to believe you WERE Babak, the Benz restorer, but the post below still applies, to help sort out some, but not all, confusion :-)
We have all received the email that the Benz Restorer is offering a reproduction pad as well. I met him in person at a local Mercedes meet this past Sunday, but even though I talked to him about how much I appreciated his enthusiasm and entrepreneurship for independently starting his own version of a firewall pad, we also talked about the quality of his reproduction. I told him that I really hoped he would still be able to sell his pad on ebay and to other customers of his, but I believed that few on this web-site would likely purchase his pad unless it were priced considerably cheaper than the one Alfred is having made. For you to make the claim "The original ones are now available" is somewhat surprising. I don't like raining on Babak's hard work and I never commented directly on his posts or to his email, but beside that pad not being fabricated out of the original raw material, the "pattern" was merely made with a die that pushes rows of square-shaped indentations into the tar-like or rubberized surface of the material. There is no real 3-d structure to the pattern at all, so that the end result does not look very much like the original. If we couldn't buy the exact, correct fire-retardant material that Alfred has found, matched to the almost identical pattern and surface texture, I must say, I would still not be very interested in buying this pad and, I believe neither would 90% of the very informed members in this community, after knowing the full story. I think I have a reputation for being one of the most critical anywhere, when it comes to authenticity on Pagodas and I hope, the club would be more than happy to work with Babak on reproducing the late model ATE brake reservoir, etc., but now that you, Smiledoc, have made this post on this thread, I thought I should comment. I think Babak's shift knobs, mirrors and other items he sells are quite good, but on this one, he jumped the gun. By the way, all of us are making virtually zero at the club's introductory pricing (even though it has been a very time consuming project for me and Alfred was not always easy to convince unless I provided him with iron-clad proof of very original Pagodas that have come through my workshop :-)). I don't think we even get one free pad (wink).....
I see this effort and possible future reproductions as the beginning of doing some really nice work, similar to the Gull Wing group and I think that maybe one day even Mercedes Benz will be convinced by the quality of our work and start working together with us, considering that the classic center in Irvine has some true enthusiasts as well who secretly do appreciate when (correct) form follows (MB) function ;-)
This also goes to Pete Lesler's comment about authenticity: While you may be technically correct that Mercedes-Benz (and the club accredited by them) might not consider the club's firewall pad "authentic", I am glad to vouch for it as being the best that we can possibly hope for, at a cost that is somewhat acceptable. The margin of error is really VERY small. I think I have already commented on the choice of the high quality synthetic felt for the backing. I would have preferred something like the original (for most cars) foam, but I think the membership had given its vote and I still think that Alfred would eventually be willing to let us offer a foam backing as well. I have gotten 5 out of five "Best in Class" trophies using a very similar, earlier version of this pad against some other very stiff Mercedes competition that normally would beat even the best Pagodas hands down. Dare I say, that some of the judges were other recognized experts, such as Scott Melnik and Tom Hanson and also this forums active member Bob Geco at events like the LA Concours at the Rose Bowl, The Muckenthaler, the Palos Verdes Concours on the Trump Golf Course (that is not supposed to be an endorsement of quality ;-) -you're fired!) and the amazing Dana Point (formerly Newport Beach) Concours.
As far as the Benz Dr.s comment about the installation, I like the idea with the wax paper because as we know, getting this two-dimensional pad onto a very 3-dimensional surface is not the easiest task. Also, one forgets that several items such as the temperature sending unit and a few cables and tubes have to be disconnected, so people with two left thumbs may want to leave this job to others. If you have no problem doing these tasks, then joining the outer, patterned layer with the inner backing should be no problem, even without a special tool.
And as far as the earlier Pagodas without the heater access hole, I honestly would see if Alfred is willing to sell you just the material and then do a one-off cut-out myself. A lot more work, but a lot better result and authenticity. The other approach would be like having the vin plate cutout pre-stamped on all pads which would simply be "wrong" for most US bound Pagodas that had the VIN plate attached to the b-pillar. For the very first Pagodas that used yet another of about 5 different materials used by MB at one point or another, you may actually be better off searching for another material.The few hundred looked like they used roofing paper.....
Regards, Tom Colitt
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I would like one for my 1971 280sl. Thank you for all of the hard leg work to get this done.
Jim K
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2 or 3 LHD for me please.
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I still want a more perfect pad from the group. But, for the weekend car show, I'm very glad to have this version!
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I'll take 2 sets of LHD when they are available!
Peter
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I'd like to get on the list for a set for my 1970 280sl
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Hello,
I want one RHD SET for my early 250 SL (VIN plate on the top of the Firewall)
Thanks
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I just found this link on recreation of firewall pad and wish to be added to list of interested members. Great job.
-
Any idea when these will become ready for purchase?
George
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Alfred,
I would love to get 3 firewall pad for LHD cars, if possible.
Thanks,
Claudia
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Garry, you'll be going into mass production in a factory in Chongqing at this rate!!
;D
Should we tell our favourite restorers (Gernold, for example)? Guess not!
-
Hello all
great efforts
Please count me in for 2 sets with extra material for under the dash for my LHD 1967 250SL
Thank you
Basem
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George,
Alfred has just had the first set die cut so hopefully for LHD cars it all should start happening in a few weeks. Alfred will be seeking funds from those that have expressed a desire for the pad shortly.
RHD cars are going to be a bit longer. Andy Totten (Drewtree) has given us access to a template through a friend and some pricing un UK for cutting and we are still working on where in the World would be the best place to have them cut to keep shipping costs down.
Garry
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Garry,
Thanks--will standby
George
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Great Job! -- I think this effort should serve as a 'model project' to potentially launch other future efforts to help maintain the 'originality' of the Pagoda.
Please put me down for four (4) LHD.
Question: Will this product be passed on to a vendor that could continue to source it beyond this initial phase? If so, which vendor, and what should the Group receive in exchange... Perhaps, it should go to several vendors so that it becomes standardized and competition ensures prices are maintained as low as possible.
Thanks,
TAPIAP
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... Question: Will this product be passed on to a vendor that could continue to source it beyond this initial phase? If so, which vendor, and what should the Group receive in exchange... Perhaps, it should go to several vendors so that it becomes standardized and competition ensures prices are maintained as low as possible. ...
Quite a number of serious questions for a first post I must say! ;)
Let me ask you one in return.
Why do you need four (4) pads? Do you have four (4 ) Pagodas, or are you in the resale business? ???
Just asking.
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Any idea when these will become ready for purchase?
George
Hi George,
I met with the owner of the die cutting company today and checked the prototypes that he cut. There was a very minor issue with one of the very narrow slots specified on the Mercedes blue print and we agreed on a modification which will not hold up the production run.
His and my expectations are that by the end of next week we will have 100 sets in hand for shipping. By the end of this week I hope to be able to provide detail photos of the cut-out firewall material and the felt backing and how it compares with the last waffle/diamond patterned pad that Mercedes sold in 1974. At that point everyone can make a final decision whether to purchase a set or not.
I plan to put all of this information, including specific details about the ordering process into the "For Sale" board where it belongs.
Alfred,
I would love to get 3 firewall pad for LHD cars, if possible.
Thanks, Claudia
Thanks Claudia.
request duly noted. I also sent you a PM, please check.
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Alfred,
Sounds great! Looking forward to buying a set or two. Outstanding job by all of you!
George Desiderio
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I actually have 7 pagodas and buying more!
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Does anyone know if this padding is the same used on the firewall for the 190SL?
Thanks,
TAPIAP
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I actually have 7 pagodas and buying more!
For resale or to keep?
-
Eventually some would resale, but mostly for keep. Looking to gradually restore them, and this will obviously take some time.
-
Does anyone know if this padding is the same used on the firewall for the 190SL?
Thanks,
TAPIAP
No. And the 190 SL is inside. Jute material, like horsehair.
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Forgive me if this has been covered but isn't the inside of the firewall also covered in the same material?
I am in for a LHD set as well.
-
Correct, inside firewall material has the same pattern. See photo in reply #31.
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The newest "available" pad...seen on my car which won a Sponsors Best Award last weekend.
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Hello all prospective buyers of the firewall pad - we finally have a price: $125 plus shipping per set!
We had another small set back again. The felt company shipped a material that is different from what I had ordered. Here is the salesman's comment:
"Alfred, I screwed up…the adhesive requirement never made it on the order. The problem is slightly exacerbated - we were out of the B-100 .. So they used our more expensive B-600 adhesive – it is a stronger adhesive – has more mils of glue on it."
This meant that I had to do some testing to make sure that the more aggressive glue would net create a problem with the assembly of the pad. Fortunately, it is still relatively easy to glue the two parts together and it was easy to put the prototype together. Complete assembly instructions will be included with each pad.
The photos show what the $125 (+ shipping) will buy you and what the finished pad will look like.
That is, what it will almost look like. Who can spot what is missing in the prototype? :)
As I wrote earlier the small die change is in progress and I am still hopeful to receive 100 sets by the end of the week.
Since the Pagoda SL Group is not incorporated anywhere and does not have a business license to sell parts we decided that David Gallon should sell the pads here in the USA and Canada. Those in the EURO zone can buy it from our member "Memmo" (http://pagode-markt.de/) although we do not know the final EURO price yet since it will depend on shipping costs, duty and added taxes.
Once we have the product in hand you can expect to receive an invoice via PayPal from David Gallon for your order, so there is no need to send in another one.
Please note, to accommodate everyone we have to limit all orders to a maximum of two (2).
In addition the membership price is only valid for the next 4 weeks and all orders must be paid by that date.
After the deadline the price will go up significantly to allow the vendors to recoup their investment in time and money.
We are planning another production run - together with a RHD pad production run - but want to wait after we receive feedback from the buyers.
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I would like to put my name down for a RHD pad when they are avaialble.
-
David/Alfred,
Based on your last post, I'd like to up my order to the max (2) firewall pads.
Will the extra material for the footwells also be made available at the same time?
Thanks,
George Desiderio
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2 left for me please. I assume you'll be posting an official ordering thread with a link to Dave? Thanks.
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Please sign me up for (at least) one set for a LHD 230SL, plus misc pieces for trunk floor and under dash.
Please put me down for two (2) sets of firewall pads, LHD 230SL. Also interested in extra material for the footwells, etc.
Thanks!
-
Thanks for all the responses. Let me reiterate once more, you do not need to post again that you want one if you did so already and you do not need to sent me or David Gallon additional emails. Once we have the sets in hand - and I'll let everyone know when that happens here - he will send you an invoice through PayPal and ask for payments.
The RHD drive pads, when they will become available, will be sent together to one address in the UK and distributed from there. Andy "Drewtee" will provide the details when we know more. Pads for Australia will be distributed by Garry. However, this is months away, we do not even have a template of the pad yet to make a die!
Extra material for other uses - trunk strips and inside firewall pads - is not available until we know that we have material left over. Once the engine bay firewall demand has been met and material is not exhausted then we plan to tackle those other uses.
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Please put me on the list -- LHD 230sl. I am especially interested in extra material for firewall and trunk. Also, I have the same material (jute version) on the floor and I would like to replace that. Will there be enough extra material for that purpose? Or should I use some other material for those non-visible areas? Thanks.
RH - San Mateo CA
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Dave / crew: Please put me down for one LH set, thanks -
-
Hi,
I'm located in France.
Could you please confirm the price including DHL shipping to France for one LHD firewall pad?
Thank you ion advance.
Best regards.
VincentR (280SL 1970')
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Vincent,
shipping to France with DHL costs $53.16 in addition to the duty and taxes that you will have to pay to DHL before they hand over the package.
It might be more convenient for you to buy it from our distributor in Germany as I explained earlier.
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Alfred/David,
Please put me down for one LHD 230SL set.
Thanks for all your efforts to obtain these. They look great.
Joe
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Dave/Alfred
Please put me down for 2 - 230SL LHD sets.
You have done a great job on these, thanks very much.
George
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Gentlemen,
Back online for a week or so, and as my original request was posted on the earlier topic thread, I thought it best to restate it here, just in case.
Please put me down for one set of The Complete Works of the SL113 Firewall Padding Working Group: an engine bay-side firewall pad set for a 280SL built in August of 1968, a pair of cockpit-side firewall pads, and material for the four 80 X 120mm pads on the trunk/boot floor.
Invoice me soon, please, as I'll be off to the boonies again near the first of the month, and out of touch again for awhile.
Best, and thanks to all,
Denny
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Dave/Alfred
Thank you to go through all this for the real German designed pads.
Please reserve 2 sets for my - 66mb 230SL LHD sets.
great job, thanks very much.
best regards
Gerhard
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Thank You for all your efforts !
I would like to purchase 1 LHD set if possible as well.
Preferably from your German contact as i am located in The Netherlands,
Thanks
Marco
280sl man. 1970
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Hi,
I had an order for one set. Please put me down for two sets. Please let me know when i have to send you a check.
Thanks
-
Put me down for 1 LH set for 1965 230SL.
George
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Thank you for your hard work.
Put me down for 1 LH set for 1964 230sl and 1 RH 1970 280sl please.
Thanks
Sully.
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... Back online for a week or so, and as my original request was posted on the earlier topic thread, I thought it best to restate it here, just in case. ...
Be glad you did since there was no indication in your previous post that you wanted one:
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=14653.msg103967#msg103967
I haven't thought myself much interested in this issue since I have what appears to be original padding on the firewall. As my ignorance slowly clears (like the fog?) I learn that I'll need some for the interior and trunk. And, for that matter, the two firewall panels seem to've aged differently - for reasons unclear. The result is that, ideally, I may want the ability to buy 'open stock' material for elementary cutting into simple shapes as well as nice, precisely shaped, complex die-cut pieces, at least for the firewall - - and perhaps only one or the other of those two pieces! [And this without introducing RHD into it. ..... ]
Anyway, your name has been added to the list.
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Hello All.
We have received the first shipment of firewall pads and during the weekend Dave Gallon will send out invoices all of you in the USA and Canada who have requested one. The invoices will be sent via the PayPal web site and to assure you that you did not receive an email phishing for your money the invoice will show David's company name and also the Pagoda SL Group emblem.
We'll send out the invoices in chronological order, that is, according to the date the request was placed and full members have priority over regular members. Please pay within the next two weeks to keep your place in the queue.
I have already sent emails to those outside the USA who requested a LHD pad (except those in Australia) but let me know if you did not receive a message.
The RHD requests have to wait a little longer.
Here is the list for USA/Canada requests in chronological order:
Full members:
Order # Forum name
1 George Des
2 pj
3 Jordan
4 labella
5 69280SL
6 bogeyman
7 Jonny B
8 Waqas
9 fmen3366
10 Markp
11 StlCardFan
12 stratmanedh
13 holden66
14 Iconic
15 daffern1
16 280SL71
17 smiledoc
18 ctm14
19 Norm
20 TOMNISTUFF
21 TR
22 chumps
23 230slhouston
24 MB-TEXada
25 jszeman1
26 Kopie
27 thelews
28 Mark280SL
29 tapiap
30 Mike
31 Kleine
32 benz55
33 pagoden
34 atlanta230sl
35 ghenne
36 mdsalemi
Regular Members:
37 dakman29
38 Nate
39 mtoomey
40 carstennh
41 LakisAkylas
42 quattrouser
43 mbforfun
44 Shvegel
45 rwh
---
List for next production run:
1. Orion
2. jetblack123
3. RTenges
4. David Williams
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Has anyone gotten these invoices yet?
-
I received my PayPal invoice yesterday.
Payment was processed and now I will wait for the arrival of my new pad.
Norm
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Same here!
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Yes, I also received and paid right away the invoice. Any idea of when the pads will be shipped?
Lakis
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Ok, there may be a problem here. According to this thread,
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=15528.0 (http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=15528.0)
David Gallon randomly stops doing business with people. I'm one of them. Could that be why I have not gotten an invoice for the pad?
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I have had trouble in the past getting hold of Dave Gallon, but I got my invoice and I have sent payment.
Chumps
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Just for the record I've received the invoice and promptly paid via Paypal.
Andy
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Hello and greetings from SW Georgia. I'm new to SL ownership and a new member here as a result. Is there still an opportunity to purchase a firewall pad (and possibly the foot well pads as well). I own a 1968 280sl LHD Euro. Thanks,
Eddie
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I have picked up the last portion of the pads yesterday and checked them out.
Four had flaws in the material and two needed to be hand trimmed but are fine, that leaves us with 96 sets for this run.
Dave informed that he has already received more than half of the payments and he has about 15 packages ready to be shipped tomorrow.
Please check them out as soon as possible and let me know your impression. We need the feedback before I order material for the next production run.
Please download the attached instruction sheet and if something is not clear don't hesitate to ask!
Thanks.
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.... Is there still an opportunity to purchase a firewall pad (and possibly the foot well pads as well) .....
Hi Eddie,
welcome to the group.
I put you on the list (see reply #110) for the next production run since this one is oversubscribed.
-
PM sent, 66andBlue.
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Just notified by paypal that the ones I ordered were shipped. Look forward to getting them. Will provide feedback.
George Desiderio
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Hi, I just acquired two 113s, a very original 230 SL and a very nice 280 SL, both with sticks. I recently found out about this site (excellent) and about the firewall recreation project.
I've joined the Group as a member and would very much like two (2) LHD firewall pads. You guys have made a fantastic effort.
I have PayPal, so payment is not an issue.
Thanks,
Bob
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Bob,
I have added you name to the list for the next production run. See reply #110.
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Bob,
I have added you name to the list for the next production run. See reply #110.
Thank you, Alfred. I look forward to "correcting" my cars!
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I got my pad today from Dave. They are really very nice. The "Firewall Pad Team" should be commended for a job well done on these!
George Desiderio
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Thank You,
Received mine today, really very nicely done. Thanks to the whole team!
Chris
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Got mine today. Thanks. Looks great
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Alfred,
I have been working with a collector on the east coast who has been very helpful as far as contacts to inspect a potential car. He has a pagoda and I told him about the quality pads the team has produced. He asked if I could help him get on the list. Would you put me down for 2 LHD in the next run?
Thank you
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Chris:
Why not have your "collector" join the Group and speak for himself.
Richard M, NYC
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Why not have your "collector" join the Group and speak for himself.
Here, here! If you want the benefits, shouldn't you join?
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He is an older gentlemen and does not utilize a computer. I know that sounds crazzy to us but pc's are not something all generations embrace.
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He is an older gentlemen and does not utilize a computer. I know that sounds crazzy to us but pc's are not something all generations embrace.
I fully understand what you are referring to. I too have several senior age auto owners/enthusiasts in my circle of friends, and they possess much knowledge and experience (and some super nice cars), but never sit in front of a computer... Of course, I strive to support them in any way I can by use of the web and digitsing images etc.
/Hans in Sweden
.
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Hello: I received my pads today, they look great. One question. In a post from 66andBlue it was stated that complete installation instructions would be provided with each pad. Mine arrived without any instructions. I can probably figure it out, but if there are any tips or suggestions in the instructions, they may be very helpful to avoid mishaps. Perhaps a copy could be posted on the site. Thanks
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Hi dakman29.
go to my reply #119 and download the PDF.
Sorry for not including them but I did run out of color toner for my laser printer. :o
Let me know if you need further hints.
Thanks!
-
.... are not something all generations embrace.
But we do - babies, newbies, geezers, you name it! ;D
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Thanks, 66andBlue, I sent you a personal message as well.
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I received my firewall pad today and it looks frickin' awesome! A big thanks to Dave Gallon and everyone involved in the recreation. Now I don't feel bad about the body shop removing my original one when I gave them explicit instructions not to (at least they didn't fill in or grind away the fender notches ;))! Hopefully this one will last another 40 years...
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Hello Nate,
I think you should re-read all the origional posts regarding who made this pad possible,when you have done that you will correct your statement and i hope you name the 3 or 4 people who really did the spade work.
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I received my pad yesterday, looks great! Many thanks!
Lakis
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A big thanks again to Alfred, Tom, Garry and Dave for recreating these firewall pads! Am I forgetting to include anyone else?
-
.... name the 3 or 4 people who really did the spade work.
Success has many fathers but failure is an orphan.
We are all very satisfied that thus far there are no complaints.
But nobody has any suggestions for improvements or changes? We have another production run coming up and want to hear!
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Alfred,
The only suggestion I have is if you could provide the benefit of some of your research on the foam and jute in case some decide to use that as a backing. Not sure what sources are out there for this. You all may know best from your research. This is not to suggest in any way that the felt backing was the wrong choice! I just know there are some who are sticklers for this sort of detail.
George
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I'll chime in with a suggestion. I love the fact that the firewall pad does not have the VIN plate pre-cut for the European cars (mine was a US delivered car so I don't have a need for this). I think the cuts in the firewall pad look like sh!@t and really detract from the uniformity of the firewall pad and a tidy engine compartment. If your car is a US delivered car like mine the VIN plate is mounted in the driver side door jamb. For those that have a need for the VIN plate pre-cut firewall pad, my suggestion would be for a buyer to be able to specify their choice, pre-cut or uncut. Kind of like the Early Ford Broncos, uncut fenders or cut fenders ;)...
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George,
you hit the nail on the head - did we ever have discussions about jute and foam backing! :o
Tom Colitt insisted on foam, whereas Franz at Silver Star, who restores cars to a very high level, preferred yellow jute.
I tried very hard to come up with a 4-5 mm thick jute but had no success. The closest is a product made for older Jaguar and other British cars called Hardura sold by Heritage Upholstery (http://www.heritagetrim.com/m_aboutmaterials.htm). Unfortunately, it is only 2mm thick or a bit less. According to their web site it is milled in the UK but I could net get any information whether they make a thicker product. My hunch is that the material for the aftermarket pads that are sold by SLS are made by the same company.
One possibility is to buy one of those sets from SLS or Buds Benz and glue our material on top (w/o the felt of course). We did that on one prototype that was sold later on eBay to test the market.
Nate,
I agree, having to separate versions for 230SL (and European 280SL) and US 280SL would be nice but then we would have had to pay for another die and then ponder how many of each to make. That was the reason why we have the VIN cut out only in the felt backing. Now if someone wants to order a set with the front already cut I think that for a small fee the wish could be accommodated. :)
Any other suggestions/ recommendations out there?
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Alfred,
Yeah, I had seen that hardura material some time ago when the discussion on this first started and thought that may be a good place to search for someone who could replicate the pattern. I'm sure you're right about SLS and others using this as the source for their pebble grain firewall pads. Never did really like that material but as you well know, it was the only alternative until now. What source did Tom recommend for the foam and what thickness? I noticed from some old pictures of my own footwells from before my restoration that the backing down in the footwells was actually foam and I may consider backing those areas with foam instead of the felt. Right now they are covered in the same jute-backed "hardura type" material that my firewall is backed with.
Bets,
George
-
Slight slip of the fingers!!
BEST
-
Hi George,
Tom C. insists on 4mm polyurethane yellow foam and plans to glue it on once he finds the material.
You can see that stuff at almost any upholsterer but usually 1/4" and 1/2" (or more) thick.
But it is a bit course and I am not sure how durable. Go to the McMaster-Carr web site, search for foam and then for color=yellow (http://www.mcmaster.com/#foam/=ew1nbh) and you'll see what is available: Temperature Range +50° to +120° F
and no bargain either!
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Alfred,
I would like to get two sets of the LHD pads-complete for the interior as well but if that is not ready, I will take just the engine area.
Thanks to you and others that pulled this off-truly the "holy grail" of items.
Best,
Tom Sargeant
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Please put my name down for the second production run. I need one set for a LHD 63 230sl.
Thx - Mait
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Hello Mait and Tom,
I have put you on the list for the second production run in addition to all of those who were on the list for the current batch.
We had a few pads that had flaws and that cut the supply short.
So here is what I have:
1. Mait 1x
2. Tom 2x
3. Orion 1x
4. jetblack123 1x
5. RTenges 2x
6. David Williams 1x
7. mdsalemi
8. atlanta230sl 2x
9. labella 2x
10. holden66 1x
11. smiledoc 1x
12. quattrouser 2x
13. atlanta230sl
14. ctm14 2x
15. menesesjesse 1x
16. Gerry 1x
17. Bob G 1x
Who is missing?
-
I would like 1 LHD pad for my 65 230SL
Best,
Jesse
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I would like to order a LHD set for my 1969 280 SL , without the vin # cut out . Thanks for all hard work that all of you involved in this project have done!
Best regards, Gerry
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Some of you who have received the pads asked me about the brownish surface hue and whether this was original so I decided to answer here in case more are interested in what we have found out.
Of course, everybody who as ever seen a good firewall pad knows that it is black and a bit shiny and the many photos that were posted in this topic and the one before by 49er and thelews, and many others demonstrate that quite well. Clearly, our material is not pitch black and not shiny, but then it also wasn't exposed to a hot engine compartment and oil fumes for 45 years either. Obviously we do not know what the color of the very first material was but we do know what the color was of a pad that was bought in 1974, and even better, we know how this color has changed after installation.
The owner of a 250SL bought two pads in 1974 and installed one in his car but saved the other one since he knew that the material has a limited life time. Dave Gallon, who is currently restoring the car, removed the pad again and guess what, it is now black but the other one is a medium gray as shown in the attached photos. The owner believes that the gray one hasn't changed color over the years since he had unwrapped it a few times to be used as a template to cut bulk material and believes that he would have noticed.
I have taken these photos in the shade and in full sunshine and on two different backgrounds, hoping that this will provide a good impression for how the surface color has changed over the last 27 years.
So, here we have a pad that was and still is gray - but not brownish - and that turned black after installation. We do not know if our material will turn black over time but given this example we think it might change too.
Since we are all used to seeing a black firewall pad and some may not want to wait an obvious solution is a color change. Because I can only attach four photos I'll show the options in my next post.
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Here are some ideas and photos showing how one can change the color of the pads to reflect more what we are used to seeing in cars.
The simplest is to use black shoe polish, it is cheap, works well and gives you an idea what the pad will look like. It is also somewhat reversible because the color is NOT water proof and will wash out again.
A more permanent solution is to use a vinyl dye and one has the choice between matte and gloss. I have use Dupli-Color HVP 104 (gloss) and HVP 106 (matte) and have shown the results to Brian Peters at Motoringinvestments. He prefers it glossy and and as thick a layer as possible to simulate old pads. My preference is more a thin layer and matte. Fortunately, the first coat of even the glossy paint will be matte because it is absorbed rapidly by the fabric and one needs to add several thin layers to achieve a gloss and for this reason one can stop at any time once the desired sheen is achieved.
But be careful if you do this, apply very thin coats only! This spray paint can be a bit uneven and one should never return a stroke above the material but only outside since the return point will get more paint and it shows. The good part is that once it has dried for several days it can be oversprayed with an acrylic dye, for example, Dupli-Color DA1603 to even out the appearance.
Her are the photos, you be the judge.
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Hi Alfred, Could you please give us a reminder here by the time the Firewall Pads are available in Europe ? thanks Marco
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Hi Alfred,
After volunteering to wait for the second batch, i sent you a PM confirming that I would take three pads one for each of my pagodas if possible.
If you could add that to your list of orders I would be happy, since I seem to be missing from your list in your postimg on the 14th of nov.
Regards
Hans
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Hi Alfred; I forgot to ask when I placed my order if you have an idea of when the second run for LHD pads will take place ? Thanks, Gerry
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Some I meet has already done the pebble finished fire wall pad. I do not care for it and would like to place an order for
my USA 1968 280SL LHD. I am sure ours will be better. Please let me know when it is complete and if you can send me price and pictures of the final product.
8 years ago I put the after market pad on my car. works well was cut nicely. But I plan to repaint the car and have some body work done, it will not be a show car but a nice driver and club display car.
Bob Geco
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.... Please let me know when it is complete and if you can send me price and pictures of the final product. ...
Bob,
price and photos and instructions are right here in this thread. $125 + shipping, just read the details.
Thanks.
-
You suggesting shoe polish.
How original is that?
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1. Mait 1x
2. Tom 2x
3. Orion 1x
4. jetblack123 1x
5. RTenges 2x
6. David Williams 1x
7. mdsalemi
8. atlanta230sl 2x
9. labella 2x
10. holden66 1x
11. smiledoc 1x
12. quattrouser 2x
13. atlanta230sl
14. ctm14 2x
15. menesesjesse 1x
16. Gerry 1x
17. Bob G 1x
18. SilverSpear 1x (Euro LHD with firewall plate)
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Here's a photo from the April 1965 edition of Australian Sports Car World showing the firewall pad disintegrating on an almost brand new 230sl. No hope of an original 230sl pad surviving.
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Recieved the Pad : thanks Guys good job !
-
I would like 1 LHD pad for my 66 230SL
Regards
Circle
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Got mine today - they look good. Thanks to David Gallon and Alfred for making this happen!
-
I'm sure I posted here the other day but my message has vanished!
I woul like a RHD pad for my manual car. Engine bay pad only. How and where do I pay. Thanks
-
Jaymanek,
Have added you to the UK list.
In due course when the pads are cut, packaged in bulk to UK and are ready for distribution, you will be contacted and given a Paypal invoice for payment and seek a shipping address.
Garry
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Hi Alfred,
Can I please be added to the RHD UK list for 1 firewall pad set for my 250 SL please.
Thank you and everybody for all your hard work,
John
-
John, you are in! ;)
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Great news thanks, I have had an email from Naj who is willing to accept the firewall pad with the others he has ordered, so if its OK please send to to him
John :)
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I would like one LHD set for a 65' 230SL. I am assuming it is not too late to get my name in for the second run of pads. I have a paypal acoount. However, I am confused how I go about purchasing this item? Is this process cover in a previous reply? Thanks for the assistance
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Hi Alfred :
I also would like to order one set for my 66 LHD 230sl if it is not too late for the 2nd run. Thanks
Eng
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hi there, could you please add me to the list? i would like to purchase two of the pads for my 71 280 SL. one for now and one for "down the road" . I would be very happy with one if supply is limited. cheers, christian
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Christian,
I have added you to the list - but it would really help knowing your name and address! :o
How about adding the information to your profile?
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I would like one LHD set for a 65' 230SL. I am assuming it is not too late to get my name in for the second run of pads. I have a paypal acoount. However, I am confused how I go about purchasing this item? Is this process cover in a previous reply? Thanks for the assistance
You need to add your name and address to your profile. This will allow us to send you a PayPal invoice for the order.
Thanks.
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Good news - I have picked up the last sets today and hope to check them out over the weekend.
Expect to see PayPal invoices in your mail box soon! :)
Updated list:
1. Mait 1x
2. Tom 2x
3. Orion 1x
4. jetblack123 1x
5. RTenges 2x
6. David Williams 1x
7. mdsalemi
8. atlanta230sl 2x
9. labella 2x
10. holden66 1x
11. smiledoc 1x
12. quattrouser 2x
13. atlanta230sl
14. ctm14 2x
15. menesesjesse 1x
16. Gerry 1x
17. Bob G 1x
18. SilverSpear 1x
19. Circle 1x
20. shvegel 1x
21. jkosal 1x
22. MBparagon 1x
23. w113NY 1x
24. mclewis 1x
[/quote]
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Hello
I have been following the forum for a while and have just come across the subject.
I am in the middle of restoring my 1964 230SL and in need a set of these firewall pads for a left hand drive. Can they still be ordered. If yes I would like a set.
I would also be interested in a set of inside firewall pads as well.
Thanks
Gil
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Hi Alfred,
I confirmed my interest for three firewall pad sets in a post in this thread on november 17, one for each of my pagodas. As well as in several PM to you directly. Still I am missing from your list. This was after we agreed thru Pm that I would wait for the second batch, since I earlier confirmed that I would take two sets.
Regards,
Hans
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Hello Hans,
I apologize for not answering your PM again - you will get the material but I was still trying to find best way to ship.
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I would like to order one set.
Thanks
Darrell Bennett
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Thanks Darrell.
You'll receive a PayPal invoice soon.
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sorry Alfred, just saw this. i thought i would get an email notification for any forum responses, i have added my info to my profile and have received an invoice through paypal today. should i just proceed with the payment at this point?
cheers, christian
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... i thought i would get an email notification for any forum responses, ..... should i just proceed with the payment at this point?
Hello Christian,
you only get an email notification if you subscribe to the topic. Click on "Topic Tools" and you will see what you need to do.
Second, yes pay the invoice at your convenience and David Gallon will ship you the items, but most likely after the holidays, first week in the new year.
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great. done. invoice paid. thanks so much for all your help and merry christmas!
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I don't know if this is the right place to do so but I would buy a LHS set if still available. I am also interested in the
Interior pads when they become available.
Thanks and Happy New Year to all.
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Hi, If not too late, I should like a LHD set. Thanks, Dale. ('71 280SL)
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This thread is for ordering a Firewall pad, getting info about paying, etc.
For information about installing the pad, the pro and cons of using contact cement, a step by step description by an amateur installer, photo of the installed pad, and more, look at http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=15812.0
Richard M, NYC
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I'd like to get two pad sets, both LHD. My contact and address info is correct in my profile.
Thanks to all who pulled this off.
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Dear Alfred,
If it is still possible, I also would be interested in an LHD set (280SL, 1970). I followed your earlier suggestion to go through the German connection, but I am not sure how responsive they would be or even if they did get any sets from you (their site is, in essence, being built). I will add/send necessary details upon your kind confirmation on availability.
Best regards,
Pawel
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Alfred, looks like the European connection you suggested worked - Mehmed knew of one piece and I am in touch with another colleague to get the pad. I hope it works. I would likestill to be in for the inside and trunk pieces, if possible....
Regards, Pawel
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I just saw this... I would love to order one if still available... My original firewall is still in good shape but would love to keep a replacement handy...
Hope it's not too late...
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Hi Michael,
no, it is not too late. :)
Watch out for a PayPal invoice in your mail box.
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Hi
I would like a LHD Firewall pad for my 69 280SL Manual car.
Thanks
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Hello,
please add your name and address in your profile so that we know where to send it.
Thanks!
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I got mine through the European channel, just arrived, thank you!
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Here's a photo from the April 1965 edition of Australian Sports Car World showing the firewall pad disintegrating on an almost brand new 230sl. No hope of an original 230sl pad surviving.
That's a nice picture Dave. I wish I could get a high resolution copy of it. Keep in mind that there were at least three different versions of the honeycomb firewall paddings used by MB. The early one you show had a thick backing, often referred to as Coco mat, Jute, Hemp, fiber, that did not provide a good support for the thin shell that was actually the heat resistant/ flame resistant portion of the pad. I believe this is why MB changed the material slightly in subsequent 250SL, 280SL cars and used a stronger "bitumen" layer and a thin 3mm foam backing instead. The foam disintegrated after many years of use as well, but at least the rest of the pad was quite durable and stayed intact on many cars....
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Is it too late to order two LHD sets?
Thanks
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I need a firewall pad for my 63 220seb coupe.
Can you furnish me with a firewall pad or supply with enough material so I can make one?
Please advise as I need one asap.
Peter
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Hi,
Are you shipping trunk pad sets yet?
If so, I will need one as well as lhd, manual shift firewall pad - lower set. Thanks.
rwh
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I am brand new to the group and this is the first tread that I have seen. I would also like to order the Firewall Pad set. I had to go to my garage and take a closer look at my pad :) , I have been hesitant in the past to replace the pad without any insulation (some restorations that I have seen) didn't make sense to me, but this project sounds great and is something I am interested in. Let me now if there are any left and what info you need from me. Thank you
P.S I have a 1966 230SL Euro(left hand drive) - Dark Green w\Black trim
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I would like a Firewall Pad set for a 1965 230SL LH drive. How much are they?
George
1965 230SL
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The engine firewall pads (LHD and RHD) are sold out and it may take some time until we have another production run.
The vendor is still looking for more of the original waffle pattern material.
Pads for the cabin firewall that are made from a slightly different material are still available.
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How much are they? My pads are cracked in a couple of spots but when sprayed with Audi matte finish tire protector look very, very good.
George
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Are the orders for the cabin firewall pads going to start to be shipped anytime soon? And maybe with the blank piece for the upper left interior firewall? The news has been sparse.
Tom Kizer
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How much are they? My pads are cracked in a couple of spots but when sprayed with Audi matte finish tire protector look very, very good.
George
For details read: http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=15615.0 Reply #68
and if you want any then send me a PM through the web site.
Thanks.
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I would like a LH set for my 70 280sl. Thanks for all of your hard work!
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Please read reply #203!
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Where`s Dave Gallon? It has been over seven weeks since I was invoiced and paid for inside pads, and three weeks since I sent a note asking for news of the shipment or tracking information in case the order was lost. NOTHING !!
Has anyone heard from him? I`m not used to dealing with people this way or being dealt with this way.
Tom Kizer
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Contact made. Issue hopefully resolved.
Tom Kizer