Author Topic: Water pump (Read 5391 times)

mauro12 · « **on:** January 04, 2020, 11:09:52 »

Hello guys, I want to replace my water pump and thermostat. Is it better to buy the water pump original from mb dealer or from sls shop or others and so non oem?
Do you know what can be the price for a water pump (250sl) from mercedes dealer ?
Thank you .

Pawel66 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 04, 2020, 12:50:13 »

Mauro, for 113043 I see in the EPC water pump is not available, PN A 110 200 02 20.

Thermostat, you would have to check or someone maybe can help, I see:

A 130 200 02 15 - just the thermostat on the drawing for $270 (roughly), and also

A 110 200 05 15 - a set, 87 degree, thermostat and gasket for $40 roughly, which is closer to where you would expect it to be.

mauro12 · « **Reply #2 on:** January 04, 2020, 13:34:32 »

Is not available anymore? Seems strange.
About the thermostat I think could be better to have the 79degrees instead of 87, what do you think?

WRe · « **Reply #3 on:** January 04, 2020, 15:19:27 »

Hi,
there are a lot of OEM parts for engine cooling available, e.g. here https://dbdepot.de/Engine-Cooling_10 because these parts are used for several models. The 79° thermostat is the right one.
...WRe

ja17 · « **Reply #4 on:** January 04, 2020, 16:02:08 »

Lots of water pumps and thermostats available and inexpensive. Just look around the Web or use some of our listed suppliers. You should be able to get OEM quality at way less than 100.00. If you cannot find one in a Mercedes box try a good German manufacturer.

450sl · « **Reply #5 on:** January 04, 2020, 17:57:53 »

If memory serves me well, there are 2 versions. Short nose and long nose model...

mbzse · « **Reply #6 on:** January 04, 2020, 18:43:19 »

Re: replacing your water pump, some wise words from M-B workshop owner Stu Ritter here:
Pump dimensions are critical
"Be very weary againsty use of aftermarket non-MB water pumps. Overheating may result, we have fixed many by replacing what seemed to be a operating water pump, that was non-MB, with a M-B rebuilt pump. The clearances between the impeller and the pump housing on most of the aftermarket pumps is excessive and the pumps cavitate.. It's amazing how much difference a few mm can make in this instance. Check your water pump to make sure that the part number is cast into the pump together with a M-B star" /Stu

The nominal dimensions of the impeller are given in the BBB and the Book of Tables. See sketch below. Note the tight tolerance of measure a: 0.4 mm(!)

See both pump models on photo here:

ja17 · « **Reply #7 on:** January 04, 2020, 20:20:28 »

If price is not your primary concern, and you want to talk to a real person who really knows these cars and parts, try Jeff at Star Quality in Monkton MD. He is very reachable by phone and will answer your questions. He will sell you Genuine Mercedes Factory New or good quality aftermarket as you request. He is a full time parts guy and owns and drives a Pagoda. This is not an advertisement, he's just the best and most accessible parts guy I know.

ja17 · « **Reply #8 on:** January 04, 2020, 20:44:27 »

I often wondered why the "weep hole" on water pump housings was never directly pointing down or at the bottom of the casting. I ran across this information today from one manufacturer "A small amount of coolant leaking from the weep hole is normal. Small drips are OK. Longer streams or continuous leaking may indicate a problem. OE manufacturers developed the weep chamber as a way to hide the small drips so pumps are not prematurely determined to be failing. Those drips will remain in the chamber and evaporate as the engine heats up."

450sl · « **Reply #9 on:** January 04, 2020, 22:19:28 »

I think it's because of the seal being of the labyrint type that a smal amount of leakage during static status is inevitable.
dynamic it seals fully.

mauro12 · « **Reply #10 on:** January 05, 2020, 01:35:01 »

For what I've just read it seems that original mb water pump is not longer available. My concern was between a febi pump or maybe GK PUMP (these are the brands that there are on sale)and a mb pump ( probably NLA) I don't have yet any trouble with the pump, but my thermostat needs to changed because it stays always opened, so for this reason I thought was the right time to replace the pump, belts and coolant. Have you ever bought a pump from sis shop or mbclassic.de or other European sources?

ja17 · « **Reply #11 on:** January 05, 2020, 02:38:25 »

Well when Mercedes lets us run out of critical items like head gaskets and water pumps for our cars we're forced to try other brands. I see on line, Gates brand new water pump, precision made, tested, with the impeller precision balanced, built to OEM specs and a lifetime guarantee for $19.95 plus shipping! I bought a new front wheel hub from the dealer for my Mercedes E430 a while back. It came from the factory with bearings made in Japan. I replaced the original spark plugs in my Mercedes SLK AMG which I bought new. The factory original plugs which I removed from the engine, from the factory had a big Mercedes "Star" on one side and "NGK" on the other side (also made in Japan). I bought some Bosch plugs the other day and they had "made in Russia" stamped on them.

450sl · « **Reply #12 on:** January 05, 2020, 08:05:16 »

That leaves us to buy from the bigger companies like febi bilstein etc.
They also sell parts from exotic countries, but we then have to rely on their quality-department.
I this is what. MB more or less does.

mauro12 · « **Reply #13 on:** January 05, 2020, 11:59:27 »

I will go to my mercedes local dealer and ask if they have availability. But I don’t think is worth to spend 200€ or even more for a pump that has only a Mercedes sticker on it.
Probably febi or gk or other brands produces spare part for mercedes with half of the half price.

MikeSimon · « **Reply #14 on:** January 05, 2020, 12:04:28 »

Bear in mind, that Mercedes never made the water pump. They bought it from a supplier. For many parts Bilstein, for example, was an OEM supplier. Once the original OE contract expired, the supplier was free to sell to the aftermarket. This is true for a lot of parts where people are looking for "original" Mercedes Benz. The only difference is, the supplier is not allowed to use the Mercedes Benz trademark, i.e.: the "Star"

mauro12 · « **Reply #15 on:** January 06, 2020, 13:56:02 »

Thanks for the information, last question is about the water thermostat . Which brand and temperature is the best for our cars? I found that behr is considered and oem supplier, are there any better thermostats? . There are 79degrees Celsius or 87, which one is the best solution to avoid overheating?

ja17 · « **Reply #16 on:** January 06, 2020, 16:24:45 »

Make sure your radiator is in good condition, have it tested. Never remove the thermostat completely. It is a double acting valve which opens one passage and closes another. I see new original Behr thermostats on-line and inexpensive.

mauro12 · « **Reply #17 on:** January 06, 2020, 16:31:46 »

These old thermostat tend to remain always open and let too much coolant pass on the radiator. As a result the car never gets to operating temp.
I have never had any overheating problem, but recently I have noticed that the car during cold weather tends to take a lot of time to get hot. For sure my thermostat is stuck open.
I heard that the long pump is better than the short one.
Are they interchangeable?
My 250sl has the short one , but is it possible to put the long pump for higher cooling efficiency?

450sl · « **Reply #18 on:** January 07, 2020, 15:42:23 »

The long pump has a bit more distance between its bearings
so theoretical a bit longer bearing life.
check if you have the extra intermediate bushing. If so you can
Use the long pump without the bushing.

mauro12 · « **Reply #19 on:** January 07, 2020, 15:55:39 »

I thought the long pump was only for 280sl and short pump only for 230 and 250

ja17 · « **Reply #20 on:** January 07, 2020, 16:15:02 »

Yes, and you'll need a set of four short fan bolts if you switch to the long pump. The long pump is easier to install also since you are not dealing with the long bolts and spacer.

Minerva · « **Reply #21 on:** January 07, 2020, 20:53:01 »

If you have a viscous fan you'll need the short pump, I found out the hard way...

ja17 · « **Reply #22 on:** January 07, 2020, 21:44:39 »

Not necessarily, some engines used a large spacer and the short pump with the viscous fan. With these you simply delete the spacer and use the long pump and short bolts.

jond907 · « **Reply #23 on:** January 08, 2020, 20:45:56 »

I've recently just bought a water pump for a 1971 280SL from MB here in San Diego and it was cheap. List price 42.50 plus a 7.75 core charge

UJJ · « **Reply #24 on:** January 09, 2020, 16:12:54 »

I just bought a new thermostat from the Classic Center (Tom Hanson).
79 Degrees - P/N: 100-200-07-15 and the price was $22.00 - with discount only $18.00
Tom always gives me a discount either because I am a member of the MBCA or because I am a member of this Forum.
Don't know about the water pump.
Urban

sandcrab59 · « **Reply #25 on:** January 09, 2020, 22:15:59 »

Joe:
Just looked at these water pumps.
I did not check part numbers but the long pump looks like the pumps on my 220D and my 3 300sd Diesels.
Let me know if they are the same pumps.
Tom M

114015 · « **Reply #26 on:** January 10, 2020, 02:17:57 »

Tom,

You are right. These water pumps (OEM or aftermarket) are more or less generic parts used on many or several different MB models, not specific to the Pagoda engine(s).
Only can be differentiated by the (OEM) parts number.

220D/8 OM615 engine ...? Most likely exchangeable.
300 D OM617 engine ...? Maybe, but I am not sure.
Only the parts lists can tell you for sure. "Visual identity" often fakes natural/actual identity which might not be true.

Other than that I can only repeat what Joe already mentioned:

Quote

Lots of water pumps and thermostats available and inexpensive. Just look around the Web or use some of our listed suppliers. You should be able to get OEM quality at way less than 100.00. If you cannot find one in a Mercedes box try a good German manufacturer.

Good luck!

Achim

mauro12 · « **Reply #27 on:** January 10, 2020, 12:56:54 »

47dollars for an original water pump ? Sounds fantastic

mauro12 · « **Reply #28 on:** January 10, 2020, 14:36:36 »

I just came back from mb dealer. They told me that the water pump is not longer available and the asking price was 770€.

Peter h · « **Reply #29 on:** January 10, 2020, 17:51:13 »

www.bandel-online.de/KueHLUNG/Wasserpumpen/FEBI_WASSERPUMPE_MERCEDES_/8_HECKFLOSSE_W110_PAGODE_W113_S-KLASSE_W108_230-280_i110_134705_0.htm?gclid=CjwKCAiA3uDwBRBFEiwA1VsajD3CagctM47UttDobXr_IutpkWbGdq4tRAkPptO8R9vOMdk7le4byRoCkhMQAvD_BwE

mdsalemi · « **Reply #30 on:** January 10, 2020, 17:53:09 »

Quote from: mauro12 on January 10, 2020, 14:36:36

I just came back from mb dealer. They told me that the water pump is not longer available and the asking price was 770€.

This is NOT a part to buy at the dealer even if available. 770€ is totally insane. There are a number of suppliers of this pump in both long and short versions. Prices at the low end would be maybe 50€ and at the high end 150€. These are all well known manufacturers such as Febi, Laso, Graf and more. I chose the Laso pump back in 2011, I think it cost me about $100 or so, and came recommended by one of our known suppliers here, Dave Gallon.

You'll see that Peter h noted a Febi for under 50€.

It was Joe Alexander to wisely told me to throw out the gasket that came with the aftermarket water pump, and use the MB OEM unit. This set me back a whopping $4 or so. But it was very clear that the gasket was superior to the one that came with the pump.

sandcrab59 · « **Reply #31 on:** January 11, 2020, 13:15:35 »

Peter H:
How do you translate the site to English.
I do not see any box with the british flag.
Tom M

mrfatboy · « **Reply #32 on:** January 11, 2020, 14:41:05 »

One way of translating the website to English would be opening the link in the Chrome brower. It will ask you if you want to translate to English.

mauro12 · « **Reply #33 on:** February 04, 2020, 12:52:16 »

Guys do you think that a defective thermostat ( stuck open) can cause a significant amount of fuel consumption , compared to a normal thermostat?
Thank you

cfm65@me.com · « **Reply #34 on:** February 04, 2020, 14:25:26 »

Yes, and it is not good for the engine to run too cold.
Regards
Chris

sandcrab59 · « **Reply #35 on:** February 04, 2020, 19:15:51 »

Fat Boy
Chrome does work. Except their page does not allow for questions.
I believe you have to use contact. By that time all info is lost.
Also Chrome does not have a favorite column like Yahoo.
All it does is place sites at the top of the page and the line is a mile long left to right.
T

ja17 · « **Reply #36 on:** February 05, 2020, 00:12:09 »

Cold coolant operating temperatures will cause the WRD to enrichen the injection system of your engine.

Shvegel · « **Reply #37 on:** February 05, 2020, 04:00:09 »

Joe I was always wondered why the weep hole faced up. Thanks for that.

sandcrab59 · « **Reply #38 on:** February 06, 2020, 13:19:00 »

Joe:
On all my diesel engines and I did not check my sl's, but the weep hole is at the bottom.
IS it different on gas engines?
Tom

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Author Topic: Water pump (Read 5391 times)

jond907