Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Body, interior, paint, chrome, and cosmetic items => Topic started by: Merc_Girl on March 15, 2021, 22:32:50
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Hi all again
So, a wee question for you
Looking at the rim of the boot of Bessy (230SL), the paintwork looks as though there may have been more than one decal placed on the rim.
It is most probably just poorly repaired paintwork prior to painting, but it does look like that there are two further rectangular ‘areas’ showing where decals may have gone?
I am probably just clutching at straws, but if anyone has ant thoughts. Sorry about photos, the areas in question look more defined ‘in real life’, so to speak!
Thanks
Katie
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I seem to remember this decal question came up a couple of years ago. I was wondering if my car was missing it also. It was determined (at least at that time🤣) my car was not supposed to have that decal. It possibly was added for later cars.
Let’s see what others think.
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Good question, Katie. 8)
Can't provide you a fully comprehensive answer here.
The white 1966 230 SL recently sold on BAT, which was supposed to be very original, had none.
The other car, a 1967 568-red 230, which Bob Cascadia sold half a year ago on BAT, which was very original either, also had no sticker on the boot edge.
I keep on looking further
Achim
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My '66 (Oct) also has no sticker. I believe the trunk paint is still original. No indications on the lip that there ever was a sticker.
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Some references here:
https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=20917.msg148452#msg148452
One more thought: the sticker in question is a reference to tire pressure sticker when luggage is loaded. Did the tire pressure stickers on the trunk lid in Pagodas have the luggage loaded tire pressure on them? Those I have seen have not. Then the sticker in question would be a nonsense. Was it really there?
The Holy Grail did not have it (picture attached).
But maybe some of the tire pressure stickers did have luggage reference? There are at least two part numbers for them.
A handful of information collected:
PN A000584 50 39 (as per Authentic Classic and on all stickers on ebay) is not on part list for W113 (116, 123, 124, 126, 129, 140, 201). There are also blue stickers with no part number.
No plate such as A0005845039 (plate, reference to tire pressures) is listed on parts list (while e.g. A 113 584 00 39, tire pressures, is listed). But some other decals are not on parts lists either.
There are decal kits for Pagoda that do not contain this sticker.
It is quite illusive and confusing. I am curious myself... Was it applied? As of when? Why is it not on part list? Was it applied when at service?
Left or right of the trunk - I think we said in the past on the forum it might have depended on having/not having trunk lid lamp where its switch rests against the trunk lid - sticker was likely to be placed on the other side (in my view: if the factory worker remembered about it).
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My 66 (Jun) 230SL had no sticker on the lip either. Only the red one on the lid behind the cross.
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Alfred, I am building a provocative plot that later cars did not have them either (or at least not all of them had it).
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Not on my 1965 230SL either other than the red one on the lid which has never been painted in the trunk/boot area. Car was picked up at Factory as a tourist delivery.
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I have the blue sticker on the lip. Seems original. The car was delivered to Switzerland from factory in april 1964. #3221.
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What about the tire pressure sticker on the trunk lid? Does it have any reference to tire pressure while luggage is loaded?
The blue sticker on the trunk lip - does it have any part number on it?
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Glad to see that I have yet again caused discord in the community! Thanks Pawel for the link, I see there was no conclusion last time!
So, Bessy is a RHD 230SL with a vertically mounted spare wheel mounted on the nearside (ie left as you are looking from the back of the car). I can’t tell if it’s original, placed on a little ‘squiffy’, so maybe a later addition or an old one peeled off then badly reinstated! The decal is mounted on the left side of the ‘lip’
Shame I can’t put decals on to cover up the rest of the dodgy paint work on the lip 🤣
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Sorry, should of said 1964, although other documentation seems to imply she was built in 1963? So Joe seems to have this sticker and ina similar age group to Bessy
No part numbers I’m afraid 😔
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I think lack of part number supports its originality. I also think this sticker is another proof of things in these cars being sometimes a little random or not always bound to strict rules, if you will. Therefore sometimes it is difficult to say definitely correct as it was always this way or incorrect as it has never been this way.
I stuck the sticker even though chances are it was never there, just because I liked it. Amd by the way: i stuck it on the wrong side as I do have the trunk lamp.
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It’s funny isn’t it. You think that a country that is always so particular in everything they do and reputation of good quality products, none the less there appears to be a level of randomness on what, or was not put on their cars at different times. Even more surprising is there appears to be no ‘formal’ record either, most unlike the German’s and their world renowned meticulous record keeping skills!
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I am having very similar thoughts and observations! My respect is not smaller by even tiny bit because of that. And this forum would be less interesting if it were not for that!
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Every nation and/or country has their reputations or perceived traits, mostly based on superficial observations and misinformation. I am German, worked with French, British, Italian and Spanish people and companies while I still lived there before I emigrated to the U.S. some 32 years ago and have now lived with "fellow Americans" for a while. I can tell you, a lot of it is myopic views.
This decal set here on ebay.de titled for W113 includes the blue sticker....
https://www.ebay.de/itm/19-Teil-Aufklebersatz-Aufkleber-Satz-Decial-Sticker-fur-Mercedes-W113-Pagode/124468079022?fits=Platform%3AW113%7CMake%3AMercedes-Benz&hash=item1cfae029ae:g:G18AAOSw629gPM-g
This auction has the same sticker, just in red....
https://www.ebay.de/itm/Mercedes-280SL-W113-Pagode-Aufkleber-Satz-14-Stuck-decal-set-Pagoda-113-sticker/353099873664?fits=Platform%3AW113%7CMake%3AMercedes-Benz&hash=item5236647d80:g:BNcAAOSwVpRe3RqB
So, the places in Germany seem to be of the opinion it was a regular W113 sticker
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My 230SL was original German delivery and as I mentioned, no sticker or signs of there ever having been a sticker.
As the two cars that have the sticker are early 230SL's is it possible this sticker was used for another vehicle (like maybe the 190SL) and when production started on the the 230SL they just used up the rest of the stickers rather than throwing them out? Just a thought.
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Yes, a possibility, or production forgot to tell the sticker guy not to put them on the new model and he just kept doing as he always had until someone noticed? ;D
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or the box with stickers happened to be there, at the end of the line, after some other model production and people just took the stickers and applied them until someone noticed... :)
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Alfred, I am building a provocative plot that later cars did not have them either (or at least not all of them had it).
My 280SL did not come with this decal. Chassis 007749, January, 1969, USA Specification.
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My 230SL was original German delivery and as I mentioned, no sticker or signs of there ever having been a sticker.
As the two cars that have the sticker are early 230SL's is it possible this sticker was used for another vehicle (like maybe the 190SL) and when production started on the the 230SL they just used up the rest of the stickers rather than throwing them out? Just a thought.
Good spot! We have an original Fiat 500 but one of the last ones made as the 126, and apparent made in Sicily! When we toon it to a classic Fiat specialist for some work, it transpired it had parts from a Fiat 126 on it and other parts peculiar to Sicilian cars (can’t quite remember what it was, maybe an optional mafia don fitted to the back seat!! 🤣)
It maybe that car manufactures use ‘left overs’ on their new models from previous variants and if new models are being made but old one as well, they fir more ‘modern’ parts to the older variants where they can as cheaper than continue to manufacture ‘old’ parts.
Pure supposition on my part, but would make economic sense, I think?
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I am pretty sure it was done like that when possible. I said it on this forum several times - when I was puzzled why my car had old carpet material. I asked an elder gentleman once in Essen, he was at MB stand, a former employee. He said: if they had older carpet good for the ordered colour combination - they would fit it. Sometimes asked the ordering party, but most of time, they would just fit it.
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I own several motorcycles made by a famous Italian manufacturer and some models have a lot of inconsistent parts selection for certain years.
It is known that they used 'whatever was in the parts bin". 8) ::)
As far as the sticker is concerned, I still wonder why the sellers in Germany include them in their sets for the W113. There must be a source telling them it is correct.
It is sure in a place where survival is unlikely.
I would like to remind you guys of the discussion about the valve cover timing and emission sticker which was totally inconsistent also.
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As far as the sticker is concerned, I still wonder why the sellers in Germany include them in their sets for the W113. There must be a source telling them it is correct.
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The source is the monthly sales report. If an item sells well as described then it must be correct.
Just ask Mr. T.D. Barnum. ;D
The local MB parts gurus here are quite adamant that it was not placed on a 250SL or 280SL at the factory, blue or red.
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Not a good enough argument, Alfred. The absence or presence of one sticker does not necessarily boost or diminish sales numbers for a kit. Example is the valve cover sticker with timing and emission info. It was on ALL Euro W113s (at least 280SLs) and some kits have it and some do not.
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I would have thought none of them had it, actually.
I have the impression some of the kits are fairly accurate, some are not. This sticker was appearing on W113, as we know, and was appearing on other models form that time. The sellers just figured out - "better to have, my kit would look more complete vs. competitive ones. Most of the owners would not know if it is correct or not anyway". That may lead to profits....
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I see ctaylor738 has pictures of his early 230SL and that has a blue decal on rim of boot/trunk
So at least 2 of us!!! 😁
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I’m just wondering if the red tyre pressure decal on the boot lid was ever in English ( as in tyre spelt “tyre”instead of “tire”) on RHD UK supplied cars? I too have a SL 230 1964 UK car
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From the parts list perspective I could find one number for that sticker (for both market clusters), A 113 584 00 39 and it is described to be in German.
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i just looked at my catalog of Bob Geco, he states
Blue foil loading label with silver type 1'x 6-1/2'' goes in luggage compartmet on lip inside trunk 230 SL to early 250 SL
mark
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And that looks like correct statement based on what we recently discussed.
I was checking tire pressure plates part numbers.
113042:
A 000 584 67 39 PLATE, replaced by
A 113 584 00 39 PLATE, TIRE PRESSURE INSTRUCTIONS;IN GERMAN
A 000 584 68 39 PLATE, TIRE PRESSURE;IN ENGLISH
113043:
A 000 584 67 39 PLATE, replaced by
A 113 584 00 39 PLATE, TIRE PRESSURE INSTRUCTIONS;IN GERMAN
and instead of English, there are 3 part numbers for other languages (not specified which ones), depending on SA codes
113044:
back to
A 000 584 67 39 PLATE, replaced by
A 113 584 00 39 PLATE, TIRE PRESSURE INSTRUCTIONS;IN GERMAN
I am curious if in cars with factory luggage sticker there is reference to luggage on the tire pressure sticker.