Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Electrical and Instruments => Topic started by: scoot on September 05, 2015, 21:03:24
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After all of the complaining I have done about not liking the "modern" alternatives to the stock Becker radios, I have finally gotten around to coming up with a compromise and testing it. This approach allows you to take any Becker radio with a DIN amplifier connection (separate amplifier), toss the amplifier, and install a modern amplifier of your choice and modern speakers of your choice. It is utilizing a converter cable sold by kip3182 on eBay, but I'm sure someone will come up with an easy DIY kit to make this if you don't want to pay kip3182 for his gizmo.
The gizmo: has a socket for the DIN plug on the end of the Becker grey amplifier cable on one side and coming out from that are 2 RCA female plugs for left and right (male plugs would have been more useful) and 2 switched 12V+ wires for electric antenna and amplifier trip switch and 2 ground wires that really won't get used for anything.
As I will possibly be utilizing this sort of setup in my 63 220S Fintail with its wimpy 30 amp generator, I was concerned about how much power this would draw. As such I didn't select am amplifier as large as many of you might want (in your cars with more powerful electrical systems).
The amplifier that I chose is a Pioneer GM-A3602 400 Watts maximum, RMS 60 W x 2 (4 ohms), RMS 90 W x 2 (2 ohms). I'm bench testing it in my kitchen using a high quality 120V to 12V power supply that is rated at 15 AMPS, and having no problem with it, so even though the amplifier is self-fused at 25 amps, I think that it isn't going to draw anything like that in normal use.
I selected some 6 x 9 JBL speakers model GX963, rated at 300 Watts maximum, RMS 100 w, 2.3 ohms.
I have pics and a video attached.
Link to youtube video here: https://youtu.be/LiiSwwhOhhw
Scott
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Scott, you may be able to fit that under the passenger seat as a mounting option.
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Scott, you may be able to fit that under the passenger seat as a mounting option.
In the Fintail that might work, although there are lots of spots in a Fintail with space. This particular installation is going into husband's 1973 Alfa GTV, which has no space anywhere for anything. It's going behind the glove compartment, which isn't ideal but not bad... He didn't want it on the under-side of the hat shelf because of the future possibility of adding trunk mounted A/C to the car. The biggest problem with that is the battery is in the way of where a compressor would go, but hopefully that project is WAY down the road.
Scott
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No prizes for breaking new ground, Scoot! Remember this conversation? :D
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=7823.0
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No prizes for breaking new ground, Scoot! Remember this conversation? :D
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=7823.0
Actually it is breaking new ground. Your thread is using the speaker outputs and the amplifier built into the radio as input to a modern amp. My thread is using the unamplified output going from the head unit to the Becker amplifier, and tossing the Becker amplifier and replacing it with a modern amplifier. Apples and oranges. One place where this becomes relevant is for cars that have Beckers with separate amplifiers, and the amplifiers go bad. It is getting more and more difficult to find a good Becker MONO amplifier. Stereo amps are easy to find since there are so many Becker Mexicos out there with dead tuning and cassette and good amplifiers.
I have to think that running the input through the internal amplifier is going to limit the frequency response range to that of the internal Becker amplifier, independent of what your next-in-line modern amplifier has, and that what you end up with is same frequency range and a lot louder. By removing the Becker amplifier from the loop I think you enhance the quality of sound and end up with the ability of using the better Becker radios that had separate amplifiers.
I've done lots of Becker bench testing and consistently the sound quality from the radios with separate Becker amplifiers is better than the sound quality from the single-piece Beckers.
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Quite.
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Great work !. when I get around to the Radio I definately want to ditch the blaupunt some numb nut put in there and go with the becker. I really like your idea about updatinging it with the mordern stuff.
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Great work !. when I get around to the Radio I definately want to ditch the blaupunt some numb nut put in there and go with the becker. I really like your idea about updatinging it with the mordern stuff.
If it's an old Blaupunkt Frankfurt then it probably was dealer-installed at time of purchase. That's what came in my car. (67 250SL). It's been replaced with the correct period small-knob Europa TR which has become quite an expensive radio due to the small-face chrome bezel used in the early Pagodas, 111 coupes, and Fintails.
With your 280SL you have a lot more options since it takes the full-sized Becker face.
In my 63 Fintail I also have a Europa TR because the correct Europa TG is just too much of a pain. There isn't a good audio in for the TR so I have a hard-wire aux-in to FM modulation that works well, cutting out the real antenna when in use. Sounds good for what it is, would sound better with a bigger amplifier...
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I keep thinking about getting a radio for mine.
I was going to go with a radio delete plate and use a bluetooth thing but I'm not sure if it might look better with a period radio in. Whats correct for a 64 230SL?
I had a look on the koenigs klassik website and it was all a bit of a minefield. I also don't know where to put speakers other than in the grille. My Corvette has it's original wonderbar radio with a pair of custom autosound speakers in the dash and they are barely better than useless. My Mustang has a custom autosound retro look radio that hasn't worked from day one and is there just to fill a hole.
I do like the look of old radios in cars though, I sort of collect vintage bakelite radios too and my repair guy is pretty good with this old stuff
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I keep thinking about getting a radio for mine.
I was going to go with a radio delete plate and use a bluetooth thing but I'm not sure if it might look better with a period radio in. Whats correct for a 64 230SL?
My best guess is the "correct" radio for a 64 230 SL is a Becker Europa TG, which is kind of a pain in the ass radio. One-piece radio with tubes and transistors. Bigger body but small face for the small dash opening. A better choice would be a Europa TR, which is a two-piece mono radio with separate amp. That would work well and you would use the center dash speaker. They sound good for their time. A small-face Europa TR is a pricey radio, maybe $500 - $700, or more if you want to buy one now on ebay. You are quite constrained with the 64 230SL in that it has the small dash opening for the small radio face - see the technical manual pages if you aren't sure what I'm talking about.
I had a look on the koenigs klassik website and it was all a bit of a minefield. I also don't know where to put speakers other than in the grille. My Corvette has it's original wonderbar radio with a pair of custom autosound speakers in the dash and they are barely better than useless. My Mustang has a custom autosound retro look radio that hasn't worked from day one and is there just to fill a hole.
I do like the look of old radios in cars though, I sort of collect vintage bakelite radios too and my repair guy is pretty good with this old stuff
I think you need to figure out where you would put speakers and then select a radio based on that.
Scott
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Whats correct for a 64 230SL?
A Blaupunkt would be correct as well.