Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => General Discussion => Topic started by: RonB on April 25, 2015, 01:58:39
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Has anybody though of doing our "own" grill badge.
I see the 300 gull wing group has one has one. Any thoughts?
Sorry I could not copy the picture - just the link.
https://www.google.com/search?q=grill+badges+mercedes&rlz=1T4RVEB_enUS635US636&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=rPE6VaGgJsProASHqYGIDA&ved=0CFsQsAQ&biw=1152&bih=524&dpr=1.25#imgrc=JV22B3GrztctJM%253A%3BzaAT8MYIg6Ca-M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi.ebayimg.com%252F00%252F%2524(KGrHqZ%252C!lwE3JVj5IKsBN-570V8Hg~~_35.JPG%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.ebay.co.uk%252Fitm%252FGULL-WING-300SL-GROUP-MERCEDES-CAR-GRILL-BADGE-EMBLEM-LOGOS-METAL-CAR-BADGE-%252F301094916214%3B300%3B280
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GULL-WING-300SL-GROUP-MERCEDES-CAR-GRILL-BADGE-EMBLEM-LOGOS-METAL-CAR-BADGE-/301094916214
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Good idea I think; as far as I can remember it hasn't been seriously considered but I might be wrong. I suppose the manufacturing cost would depend a lot on the size of an order? Come to think of it, this might be a nice 'Group Gift' (coming back to the question what could be done with the Group's funds surplus that has been burning a hole in our pocket for some time) to loyal members, i.e. perhaps all those who have been a full member for at least three years could receive on, with those reaching that status getting one on their second renewal. Non-full members and the general public can purchase one at cost plus X% mark-up. Anyways, just a thought.
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I wonder who is making these .............
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MERCEDES-BENZ-SL-CLUB-PAGODE-CAR-GRILL-BADGE-EMBLEM-LOGOS-METAL-ENAMLED-BADGE-/291438955035?hash=item43db1d8a1b&vxp=mtr
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That looks like the official emblem of the SL Pagoda Club in Germany. http://slpagode.mercedes-benz-clubs.com/Shop/324/de/001
Regrettably they do not have all articles on their webshop.
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Like everything else in this world, all it takes is a vision, and a little money. ;)
http://arniebrown.com/car-badges/
Minimum order is 40 badges at USD $30.00 each. Unit price drops to USD $25.00 with quantity of 100.
One time setup charge of USD $250.00.
So, if 100 of us would pony up for a badge, the total cost is $27.50 each. Then there is the issue of shipping to one location, and re-shipping from there. That's a "labor of love" and would cost an additional $5.00 each to US locations, just a guess, and perhaps close to $10.00 for international shipping.
This is only one vendor I'm sure there are others...
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I think this is a great idea! As a full member, I would even be happy to pay for one, especially if the design and appearance were 'right' and I was going to mount it.
I suspect that there may be several opinions on the design though! I like the look of the German Pagoda group's badge.....
Charles
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I like the look of the German Pagoda group's badge.....
Sorry Charlie--that group would be one of the "official" clubs with the official and common club badge/logo, just like the Gull Wing Group and the 190 Group. We're on our own for a badge design...
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As the first Board Member to comment, I also think it is a good idea and I think it is something that the Board should put together as part of the Group. I will put it down as an item for the next board meeting to purchase and have available in the Group merchandise.
To decide what the layout of the badge should be is probably something that we can come back to the Group for a vote.
Garry
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I'm in also. I would buy one if we had it made.
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I also would spend money for a 'badge ' , maybe the club can underwrite some of the costs ,then full members pay something then everyone else pays more .
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Great initiative - I would certainly be in.
Just a thought - how many of the windscreen decals do we have left? Would it replace them?
Richard
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Richard,
Currently with each new membership we send out two windscreen stickers together with a past edition of Pagoda World in the welcome letter. To put in the badge rather than the stickers would potentially radically raise costs and the postage but it is something that the Committee can consider when they look at producing badges.
Garry
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Thanks for the great response. I really like the "Gull Wing Group Badge" It make for something much more interesting - don't get me wrong - I like the "STAR" but
everyone uses. The badge could be the same one as the windscreen stick or something like it. Many of us would has have the MB Club badge.
It would be more of a statement.
If possible there are several art pieces of the w113 - maybe someone lets us their art - never know - just have to ask.
On the first link it give a mired of badges - so lets ask in a reasonable time and do something out standing 8)
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To All
I am going to close off and combine the other discussion on the grill badge and use this topic to guage numbers and interest in the Group producing the badge so that the Board can discuss the matter and make an informed decision. This does not constitute a commitment on your behalf.
Therefoer can I ask all interested people to just vote. If there was enough interested members and the board does proceed we would again come out to the members seeking commitment.
Garry
Membership Administrator
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Does anybody have an idea on how a badge should be fitted on our SL's grille?
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Jowe,
go here and take look at reply #10: http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=15404.
Personally, I would not ever mount a badge to the grill of my Pagoda, the star on the hood looks mighty fine for me. ;)
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Here's a recent thread on mounting options:
http://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=22285.0
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Some owners mount them in conjunction with the front license tag or bumper. They also make a nice garage display or show event display when not mounted on the car itself.
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The Concours f/k/a Meadow Brook, which is now Concours of America, uses the Grill Badge concept on commemorative plates given to attendees. They do NOT have to be mounted on the grill to enjoy them.
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OK Guy 's & Doll's, This is what all started the whole discussion.
I just want the cherry on " O GiGi " - a badge and here is the holder for our SL's front or back or both that would make "her" happy. :D
Click Like: > http://www.gominigo.com/badge-holders.html
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Heya Ron,
here is the (almost) perfect badge for your 2nd girl friend: ;)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151477688794 or http://www.ebay.com/itm/151477686486
Absolutely rust free! ;D and he can easily change the 230SL to a 280SL to make it perfect.
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Nice - but need's to be 12 -18 dia. for the man cave
Thanks
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I wonder who is making these .............
http://www.ebay.com/itm/MERCEDES-BENZ-SL-CLUB-PAGODE-CAR-GRILL-BADGE-EMBLEM-LOGOS-METAL-ENAMLED-BADGE-/291438955035?hash=item43db1d8a1b&vxp=mtr
Joe
when you click on this link you will see the name of the seller that is also a link in itself. It gets you to the seller page that explains that the seller and probably producer is based in India.
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Here are my two or actually four cents:
- I am also in;
- I like very much Peter's idea that the emblem is awarded to Full Members. The voice of wisdom spoke and I fully subscribe to that proposal;
- The US based producer proposed by Mike looks extremely respectable;
- I am a bit puzzled by the discussion about how the emblem should look like (I take we speak about the face of it). Don't we already have our logo to be just replicate on the emblem front face?
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Hi Gang. Garry has already begun to do some due diligence on this. The current emblem is not a logo and several of us feel it won't translate well as a badge. Most of us think a badge is a good idea so, we have an opportunity to have some fun with this. Let's have a contest to come up with a new logo that makes a great looking badge.
Start with a new graphic design that is suitable for the limited detail of a badge. It should be simple and recognizable from 20 feet. It cannot cross any copyrights or trademarks. You'll have to grant the Club unlimited reproduction rights. If you are a professional designer or a talented amateur, please send me or Garry a PM so we can collect your designs. If you are the one who submits the ultimate design, we'll give you three badges without charge and a certificate that credits you as the creator. The Executive Committee of the Board of Directors will be the judges. Deadline for entries is June 1, 2015.
Cheers!
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Quite apart from designing, manufacturing and distributing the badge, mounting it would not be easy. Our "radiator grill" panels don't lend themselves to a badge.
Gus
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To add to Ray’s post, we are able to get four colours within a reasonable price and possibly 6 if needed so keep that in mind when doing art work.
Gus, those with front Rego plates are at an advantage, they go well on there. ;D
Garry
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Here are my two or actually four cents:
- I like very much Peter's idea that the emblem is awarded to Full Members. The voice of wisdom spoke and I fully subscribe to that proposal;
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Hi Stan,
I know my eyesight isn't what it used to be but I have read and re-read Peter's reply #3 and cannot find this kernel of wisdom you are writing about.
What specifically did he suggest?
I am curious why full members should get an "award"! ???
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Maybe Stan is referring to reply #1.
When the club logo was decided upon, Bob Geco had also submitted a few design ideas that were quite nice as I recall. Due to computer changes since then (2002) I don,t think I have them anymore, but he might or other old hands on the first Board might.
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I think providing a grill badge to all Full Members is a bit of a risky idea. The logistics (as Michael Salemi pointed out) will be tough, the shipping costs high, and I reckon will go towards $20 per item out of the US. Rough estimate: that means $35 (the badge) x 700 + $5 shipping US x 400 + $20 (Shipping elsewhere) x 300 = $ 32500. Bang. Gone are all of our reserves in one fell swoop.
However, if you'd like to do this, feel free. Now all you need to do is find a volunteer.
Peter
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I think we have gone off track. Ray and I were not inferring that each full member will be given a badge, I think what Stan was saying in his four cents worth on the idea was that the sales of the badge may or should be restricted to Full Members only at this point.
Garry
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My suggestion wasn't that every full member receive a free badge, but only those who have been a member for at least X (could be 3, 5, ?) years and that, subsequently, those reaching that anniversary would also receive one in future years. That would probably cut down the number significantly below 700, in fact as low as one would want, just increase the number of prerequisite years. That way also those full members would benefit who contributed most to the club surplus as that has accumulated over the years.
But of course they can just be offered for sale, no freebies!
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As a follow up to what has already been disucssed: As a former president of MBCA, I was honored to represent MBCA at the International Presidents Meeting which is held in Stuttgart each each.
While there, a major discussion ensued there in the appropriate use of the MB Star logo which is extremely well guarded by their legal people.
umi
We ,as an entitiy, are not officially recognized by MBCCI (Mecedes-Benz Classic Car Clubs International. They, are in turn, funded by the MB Museum and include only four recognized Clubs in the USA: MBCA, Intetnational 190SL Club, Gullwing Group and the M100 Group. So we cannot use a badge similar to the Pagode badge, for they are officially recognized.
Perhaps due to the Interntational make up our our club, we can pursue offical recognition?
Here is their web portal: http://mercedes-benz-clubs.com/
W113SL
Pete Lesler
here is their web portal:
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Maybe we should put in for membership to MBCA first.
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Thanks Pete,
We've discussed possible recognition extensively with Mercedes. So far the answer has always been 'no' although it's never really clear why not and what the criteria are. In the end we don't need Mercedes for anything, it's just a 'nice to have'.
As an international club, applying for 'membership' with any national club such as MBCA or the UK MB club, would need to be seriously considered as that would take away, in my opinion, from our international foundations.
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... As an international club, applying for 'membership' with any national club such as MBCA or the UK MB club, would need to be seriously considered as that would take away, in my opinion, from our international foundations.
Maybe we should put in for membership to MBCA first.
I agree with Cees, joining MBCA as a subgroup would not serve our international interests. More importantly since we now have just incorporated this step would need to be reversed since we would fall under the jurisdiction of the MBCA by-laws.
I do believe that MBCA already has a W113 group but I do not know its current status.
Finally, those who absolutely must have a badge to decorate their cars really don't need our group they could simply buy this one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/291444207207
"Pagode SL-Club" is close enough to "SL113 Group", don't you think? ;)
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...joining MBCA as a subgroup would not serve our international interests. More importantly since we now have just incorporated this step would need to be reversed since we would fall under the jurisdiction of the MBCA by-laws.
It's all moot since it has been discussed and dismissed. BUT to set the record straight, there are 80+ section of the MBCA, and each section is its own (or at least most of them are) corporation with its own set of bylaws.
As for international, that's as nebulous as the often raised issue of "conflict of interest" in various schemes that people bring up here. There ARE international sections (outside the USA) of the MBCA, including several in Canada.. There was one in the Caribbean once, but I believe that disbanded...
But the group we have doesn't really need much affiliation (either with DBAG, MBCA or any other entity) since, I believe, its goals are being met...right? We have members, money, organization, interest and everything else that a successful organization or club needs.
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I fully agree with Michael. Well said.
Urban
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Joining MBCA would be like buying passage on the Titanic. This group has a strong identity and name recognition of its own - affiliation is neither needed nor desirable.
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I neither endorse nor reject the premise of our origanization joining MBCA.
There was an effort to start special subgroups some years ago, without a specific geographic location for organizations such as us. In other words an "at large" group.
The situation is presently: Some of us would need to join MBCA at the full fee unless there could be a lower fee negotoated since we would lack a specific section affiliation
I will be attendingt the MBCA Spring National Board meeting via teleconference May30. If you woud lke for me to explore this I would be willing to test the water sto see if this even makes sense.
W113SL
Pete Lesler
ds i willin belhalf of SL.ORG.
W13SL
Pete Leslers
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We've discussed possible recognition extensively with Mercedes. So far the answer has always been 'no' although it's never really clear why not and what the criteria are. In the end we don't need Mercedes for anything, it's just a 'nice to have'.
Whatever this MBCCI is... besides another layer of bureaucracy... seems CRAZY that there is an M100 group and no W113 group. Why would MB possibly want to throw up barriers to groups like ours (can't show the front of the car w/ star in grille for fear of legal action) that keep the passion and spirit of Mercedes cars alive and in front of the public? Puh-leez.
My guess is that if the right people are contacted and the stats of this group's membership (numbers, countries, international reach, etc.) are conveyed, they'd have no problem giving us an 'official group' blessing. Now more than ever considering Pagodas are, finally, achieving widespread recognition as real collector cars... proven with multiple articles in the automotive / collector car press over the past 18 months, big money results at high profile auctions around the world, etc.
Seems like a no brainer.
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Seemed like a no-brainer to me as well, but there you have it. MB has a one country, one club policy, at least had, and that was the official reason for keeping us out for some time. At the same time though, they were recognizing other MB type clubs in Germany. Go figure. When I challenged them on this, I never got any response. Someone close to the organization told me once they don't know how to deal with a truly international club like ours, we may be the only one, and they're used to thinking about the world in a country structure, which is how their distribution network is organized, country by country.
But maybe better to get back on topic ...
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I cannot understand why Mercedes would not recognize our Pagoda SL Group. Fine we are international, Mercedes cars are sold all over the world. Perhaps Dieter has to have a Heart to Heart talk with Dieter Zetsche :) I'm 16 years his senior and I was born in Germany, he was not, so I our rank him on those two counts anyway LOL Ah never mind we have a much nicer group anyway :)
I better get back to topic ... count me in for one ... if the group order is a go.
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This discussion has gotten WAAAYYY off track. As a reminder, very recently your Board inquired about official standing with DBAG and we were declined. So let's put all discussion of that and affiliation with MBCA aside. Just know that we cannot use the Mercedes Logo.
The photo in our current emblem has been publicly in use for so long that it would be easy to argue that any enforcement of copyright has been waived through inaction. I just don't want us to go there.
SO, let's start fresh.
We should be able to develop a real, completely legal, logo for our independent group that we will be proud to show on cars, on a wall, on a mantle. It's up to the buyer. If we do this at all, it will be for cost or perhaps below with a slight subsidy. So quit kvetching and start sketching! :) I'm looking forward to seeing some creative ideas.
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Here is my sketch, there is nothing better than honoring tradition and keeping your logo consistent, seriously! :)
(http://www.sl113.org/tl_files/sl113/logo_250.gif)
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Alfred,
Your artwork has certainly has the advantage of following Ray's prescription: quit kvetching and start sketching!
In any case, one of the comments to my earlier post that our logo used so far is too detailed and will be unreadable from a distance is not serious one. Our red Pagoda is very recognisable. As for the Club's name it is very long anyhow...
The only easier detail I could think of is the MB star, but that's another well known story. If we cannot use it, than what else?
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Here is my sketch, there is nothing better than honoring tradition and keeping your logo consistent, seriously! :)
Your artwork has certainly has the advantage of following Ray's prescription: quit kvetching and start sketching!
This has already been discussed off line. First, we (the group here) does not own the rights to that photograph, to the best of my knowledge. Thus use of that photo as it is, or even as a posterized, flat color version, couldn't be done without seeking permission of the copyright owner. This is why President Ray Hays has thrown the option open for something new.
For a badge, you are pretty much limited to the use of flat colors, not continuous colors of a photograph. So, for one of the badge production methods, you are limited to four (4) flat colors, unless you pay for more.
The existing logo could be posterized--turned into flat color--but that doesn't change the copyright issue.
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...Thus use of that photo as it is, or even as a posterized, flat color version, couldn't be done without seeking permission of the copyright owner. ...
So who is the copyright owner? The photographer, Daimler, the owner of the car? The photo is in the public domain now.
However, since the owner of the car is one of our full members here it is easy for us to ask whether we can use the image of his car, or even shoot a new one.
(http://www.sl113.org/imagebank/images/vanesp/pagoda50th12.jpg)
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So who is the copyright owner? The photographer, Daimler, the owner of the car? The photo is in the public domain now.
I'm pretty sure that DBAG is the owner of the photo that appears on our existing "logo". Originally, it would be the photographer and then it might be sold or assigned, such as if the photographer was paid by some agency or corporation. One should not assume that just because a photo has been widely published or publicized, that it's in the public domain.The internet has made somewhat of a mockery of DRM (digital rights management) but availability, publishing, etc. doesn't necessarily mean one can use the photo--even if the photo were used as an inspiration for something similar.
To be specific, that photo is photo number: U17265 on the Daimler Global Media Site. That media site contains a notice that all the text, images, graphics, sound files, animation files, video files and their arrangement on Daimler Internet sites are all subject to Copyright and other intellectual property protection. These objects may not be copied for commercial use or distribution, nor may these objects be modified or reposted to Web sites other than for editorial purposes. It's quite likely that if one sought permission to use this, it may be granted. Why not just start with something new and call it our own?
Nobody says you'd have to give up your window sticker!
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Has anyone noticed that we should be talking about a "grille badge," or was this something we would mount on our barbecues?
Cheers,
CT
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So why not have our Members submit a photo and once we select one use it in the "Badge we plan to call our own, what can be sweeter then using one of our own, photographed and submitted by one of our Members? Or as has been suggested a sketch of that photo submitted by one of our Members?
Any thoughts along those lines?
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Chuck,
You want to put it on the car :o :o :o
One of the problems with using a photo is to convert that to a limited number of colours and using our existing emblem produces something like this
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I`m with you Gus - the mesh component of our grill is quite flimsy and set back a fair way so any badge would be hard to see. Maybe a badge that could be attached to the side of the number plate would be better - or even a key ring..............
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I didn't have a chance to read these complete post but I did see the topic. I can help design and manufacture a badge. Somebody just needs to tell me their opinions as to what they would like and we can put it together.
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Here's an example plagiarized from another badge found on the internet, just to show what is possible
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Hi, I have watched the posts in this this post with interest. To me, the key elements on the badge should be "pagoda group" and www.sl113.com. Neither of these these terms can be objected to by others and the website address belongs to us and could act as a marketing tool to prospective members. Personally i don't think we need a picture of a pagoda on the badge. I like like the laurel leaves on the 300SL badge just discussed too. Perhaps Pagoda group around the top from say 10"oclock to 2 o"clock, laurel leaves down to 8 o"clock and 4 o:clock on both sideds and then the web address from 8"oclock to 4 o"clock?
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I like Rutger idea and then use the same style of image as they use on the 300 group.
Front 3/4 with top down and 3/4 rear with hard top on. (w113.)
If we do our own photos - there is no copy right issue.
I would not attach the badge to the grill. One needs to purchase badge holder and would attach to the license plate, either font or rear
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I think the idea from Ray Hays who threw it out here is to get some sketches together, not just ideas for others to use...
The Gull Wing Group has two cloisonné grille badges, shown below.
The use of the laurel design is an essential and integral element of all of the [sanctioned] MB club logos. It is integral and essential as it is derived from an older Mercedes-Benz logo. If we made something with it, it might be deemed inappropriate usage, as this too, is copyrighted; each club (such as the MBCA) is bound by usage agreeements, too. It doesn't make sense to court any potential issues, which is why Ray asked for something new.
So, as Ray said--let's come up with something original and distinctive that would be our own, and not using any copyrighted designs or photos to serve us well as a grille badge.
I've never been fond of the photo we currently have for use in a "logo", but that's just my opinion not shared by all. I personally don't like photos in logos, my own belief is that logos should be graphic representations, not photographic. The one chosen does not convey our "international" status which is very important to a lot of people. Surely it is a well known photo but of one specific car, used in a limited fashion that was not indicative of the Pagoda's lot in life. Since we are many cars to many people all around the world, the logo/badge that I come up with (if I can beat Ray's deadline!) as an offering will try to convey that. Text, as it were, is something that can always be added, deleted and changed as need be. You can use a logo with or without a web address, for example.
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I'm a professional photographer based in Prague. My 280SL (Silver/red) is near completion (ETA 10 days.....) I would be happy to do photos and hand over complete copyright control to the group.
Matthew
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... To me, the key elements on the badge should be "pagoda group" and www.sl113.com. .....
How is that one? Laurels and colors can be added too.
There is a screw head where the "Star" is for mounting. I believe, even Michael will agree that this would not violate any perceived copyright issues. ;D
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What about a Pagoda SL Group license plate frame for US and Canadian tags?
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How is that one? Laurels and colors can be added too.
There is a screw head where the "Star" is for mounting. I believe, even Michael will agree that this would not violate any perceived copyright issues. ;D
Great start! I like it. Needs some refinement but it ticks some boxes here. Of course you've annoyed our friends in Australia, NZ, Hong Kong and UK with a LHD car but some compromises must be made!
Don't blame me Alfred, I've heard from many people--you do NOT want the MB lawyers knocking on your door so best to get smart and play nice.
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Great start! I like it. Needs some refinement but it ticks some boxes here. ....
OK, fire up your graphics program, Michael, finish it and grab the laurels - but don't forget to add them first! ;)
They are not copyright or trademark protected, though Ovid and Caesar might turn in their graves:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurel_wreath
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Gentleman, what about asking The Designer if we can use his drawing in our badge/logo he has meet many of us including Michaeal I'm sure he would feel horned if we ask him. All he can say is no ... I cannot think of a better artist then the designer of our cars.
Any thoughts?
Just so no one get's excited the attached image is a photo that I have taken of a print that I purchased and had framed, it resides in my man cave. So I hope I have not broken any copyright laws by posting it here :)
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I really like the 66 and blue design if the laurels are included. The front-on view defines the pagoda look, I can overlook the steering on wheel being on the wrong side too!
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I like 66 and Blue's design too, keep it simple! I found the 300SL badge too cluttered.
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I like 66 and blue's attempt as well. I was working on something similar myself. Here is my attempt so far (still a work in progress..... map to fit within blue outline and pagoda line drawing should be translucent etc...).
I agree, the laurels would make a nice addition.
Charles
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Just a comment. I like Alfred's design as a start but I also wonder whether a SIDE or ANGLED profile of the car could be better than front on, to show the distinctive roofline .
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I am with Mark as a 3/4 view - slightly elevated is probable one of the best angles.
It will show roof line - elegant lines of the front, side and roof line all in one image.
With the addition of a laurel with bring to the top.
We need to remember that these badges will be around a long time.
Ron
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There is a screw head where the "Star" is for mounting. I believe, even Michael will agree that this would not violate any perceived copyright issues. ;D
Alfred...
especially if the screw is a special one.... with three wings...
would need a special screwdriver for it, but it is worth the effort: no copy rights violated ;)
like here: http://www.phillips-screw.com/tri-wing.php
or something like on the images below
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I like 66 and blue's attempt as well. I was working on something similar myself. Here is my attempt so far (still a work in progress..... map to fit within blue outline and pagoda line drawing should be translucent etc...).
I agree, the laurels would make a nice addition.
Charles
Hello Charles,
adding a globe in the background is a great idea, love it!
Please keep us up to date on your progress.
[/quote]Alfred...
especially if the screw is a special one.... with three wings...
Stan, nice twist on the mounting screw.
However, I believe it is better to have a threaded stud on the back for mounting or a mounting extension at the bottom. The badge could be screwed onto a short bracket for which allows mounting to the license plate or other points.
Here is a pic showing how the German Pagode badge is mounted.
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If we are looking at the possible world map in the background, as a Mercator map, then it may be a good idea having an oval badge rather than round which can be done by a/the badge maker if we wanted it that way.
Garry
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I'm so proud of you guys! There are some great ideas cooking. If we can truly have a Logo as opposed to an emblem, it could serve us in so many areas beyond only a badge. I want to stick to the June 1 deadline so that we can turn this from discussions and ideas into a reality.
Remember: No copyright infractions. No star, laurels, if used, must be different; they can be an homage. We are international. Simple is probably better than detailed. 6 colors is likely a maximum. It does not have to be round.
I look forward to seeing your designs.
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.... I look forward to seeing your designs.
... and yours too! No cop outs. ;)
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Note that with the right software we can have the world map visible through the Pagoda.... I think that would look better. Here's an experiment (I'm on my work computer so don't have all the graphics tools available to remove all the stuff outside of the oval). This can't be used as I don't know who owns the pagoda picture
(http://www.sl113.org/imagebank/images/vanesp/pagodabadge001.png)
This is what the German official club also has... I rather like their drawing of the Pagoda... maybe we can find out who produced that...
(http://www.sl113.org/imagebank/images/vanesp/slclubpagodelogo361pix.jpg)
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Nice Job Peter,
With a program in Photo Shop use a program called Topaz.
It will take a photo and create line drawing.
There are several others that will work also.
RonB
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I noticed that after an initial heat, the question is now somewhat drifting away. For not being able to produce any drawing (my talents are limited in that area :)) I count on the imaginative and innovative proposals from the more gifted Members, or at lest those with a good drawing computer program...
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Just returned from travelling to Florida and did not see this thread about Badges.
I agree with Alfred a badge on the SL grille does not do it justice.
When in Germany in 1972 picking up my 220D at the factory we travelled all over eastern Europe and southern Europe.
My grill has many Badges on it. Of course they are worn out today.
On an old Mercedes they look great, but on the SL's it would not go.
One suggestion was attaching it to the license plate surround piece.
That is OK but I have seen Badges on other foreign cars that have an arm screwed to the bumper or elsewhere and at the top of the arm
sits the Badge.
This makes it separate from the body and if you sell the car you can keep it for a remembrance.
AS far as the design is concerned Peter has a good idea about the world in the background but I like the Gull Wing raised car (Silver one not the red one)
it should not be a picture. If you look at other foreign car badges there are many ideas. At the moment I cannot recall them all.
Tom
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Hi gang, There is still time to submit your suggestions for the Grille Badge/Club logo. I'm arbitrarily extending the deadline to June 8th to give you another weekend to be creative. We've got some good input but there is always room for more.
Cheers!
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Great.
I commit to buying two. Will think of designs.
J.
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Note that with the right software we can have the world map visible through the Pagoda.... I think that would look better. Here's an experiment (I'm on my work computer so don't have all the graphics tools available to remove all the stuff outside of the oval). This can't be used as I don't know who owns the pagoda picture
(http://www.sl113.org/imagebank/images/vanesp/pagodabadge001.png)
1) Removing "all the stuff outside of the oval" would be a great idea as it would get rid of California.
This is what the German official club also has... I rather like their drawing of the Pagoda... maybe we can find out who produced that...
(http://www.sl113.org/imagebank/images/vanesp/slclubpagodelogo361pix.jpg)
2) The German club's rendition and the earlier proposal showing the car "head-on" seem the best for displaying the unique shape of the Pagoda. I know this exercise is slanted toward the development of a car badge, but it also appears that these ideas would work for a relatively low cost transfer that could be applied to the inside of the windshield or to the glass in the hardtop.
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Here is a drawing that we did for our 50th celebration done by a member that may help if someone wishes to put it into an oval or circle with the world background
Garry
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Gary:
The only 2 things I would suggest is adding
1-W113 to the license plate and making it a rectangle to look like European plates.
2- Removing the heavy black line that outlines the rear window.
It is too dominating. at least in the drawing you sent.
Tom M
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Garry
Like that one - although the radio antenna is a tad intrusive
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I'm not creative in design, but I'll buy one when it's ready.
Is it helpful to the club if we prepay purchases?
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I like the idea of a badge, and i have some suggestions about the approach. First: most but not all members will want one, and these will not be inexpensive to produce. In fact, if we need to employ design resources (which I believe will probably be needed to turn out a badge that effectively reflects the pride of ownership so evident among group members) the cost will run in the neighborhood of a year's membership for each badge at a production run of 2,000. Not a big deal to most, but I believe it argues against making this a membership benefit as opposed to an individual option. Second, design is not easy. There are some great suggestions in this thread but, imo, they are not on the marque (sorry). A grill badge is an emblem, and it should serve as a symbol of a particular quality or concept related to the group and/or the W113. A pic of a W113 is, imo, too literal and complicated to serve as an emblem. Perhaps there is a member with professional logo design experience? If not, I would support retaining someone.
Hope the helps and does not offend,
g
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My abilities in design are somewhat limited, I can share a picture of an actual German badge if need be (I have the bumper version, not the grill version). I would buy two if we produce it - just for interest reassurance....
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How does that look?
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I just found this topic. I don't have time to read all 4 pages of posts. Was a design selected? What about our circular logo on our home page? That could be simplified to a line drawing and filled with nice colors to look good. Sorry I'm late to the party!
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Rodd:
Glad to see you getting back in the groove, after a few years of absence.
Mark always talks about you and your car, he likes it.
We can't wait until September to see you again.
Tom
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Rod,
It is still a work in progress at the moment. Hopefully there will be some news in the next few weeks or so.
Garry
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I have a couple rough sketches for a grill badge.
Would like a little input. The finished badge would (with gull wing ) would have our Pagoda. Globe could be added if we wish.
The globe one is my hand drawn cut and past old style.
Thanks Ron
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I think it delivers the message and if you make Pagoda on it look the same style as Gullwing - I think it is quite cool, actually!
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I am just wondering if deleting the 2 driving lights would make it look more original.
Frank
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I have looked thru whole site and unable to find any "Grill Badges" available for purchase.
I know it was discusses in making them available. Did it fall between the cracks?
We have a great design - now it just need to go to the next step.
Thanks for all the input of our members in the pros and cons of a grill badge.
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IMHO, the car should be larger so that it's proportionally stronger.
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I was wondering - has this gone anywhere? Or maybe found its way to a different section? Probably quite a few people still interested...
I carrythe sticker with price on the windshield, but a badge is a badge...
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It has not gone anywhere to my knowledge.
I did some investigation on the process and spoke with a couple of vendors a couple of years ago.
The process first required a logo--which we now have. At the time this started we were working with the older photo-logo. Now we have one more appropriate to the process.
It would have to be raised as a discussion point at a board meeting with an action item to pursue the project.
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I will ensure it is brought up with the Board Meeting next. It was shelved last time as we were about to go through the process of changing the logo which I recall was because the old logo was too difficult to do such things with due to multiple colours and it has slipped through the cracks since then.
Garry
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Thank you!
That's what I hoped for - the new logo is great and it fits the purpose of the badge.
I still confirm willingness to buy when it is there.
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I would also like to buy 2-3 pieces. ;D
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Make sure you vote in the new poll!
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The new Pole that Powel is referring to can be found ...
Here ——> https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=26855.0;topicseen
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I just came across this reference to a website that produces the enamel badges we are talking about:
http://www.arniebrown.com/ (http://www.arniebrown.com/)
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Just received mine. Michael: Great job. Again
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Received my new grille badge couple of days ago. Very nice! Didn't like the way it looked on grille so made a small bracket that attaches to the rear license plate bracket. Here it is!
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Autsch (that is German for “that hurt”) .... my baby would never forgive me if I drill holes into her perfect body :) besides normal position would be up front.
I think you may have lowered the value a bit of your Pagoda, in my humble opinion.
Dieter
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No, no! Certainly no holes in the body. It is attached to the license plate bracket.
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I did the same because I have to use some DMV supplied cheap aluminum tags for my yearly license plate stickers.
California has a program where owners can use old original license plates issued the year the car was made; it is called "Year Of Manufacture" (YOM) program. However, to be legal the original year label cannot be obscured - for my cars 1964 and 1968 - so DMV sends along two of these cheap tags for the yearly registration stickers. See first photo.
I thought to combine these yearly stickers and the badge and attached them to a stainless steel sheet that I attached to the license plate frame. While it worked as a prototype I am not sure I like the mirror finish of the new bracket and especially the rivet heads. (The new bracket is actually straight with the frame although it looks crooked in the photo).
Have to try a darker bracket - perhaps in chassis color? - and perhaps separating the three parts. Badge on the left (as Enrique did) and stickers on the right.
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Received my new grille badge couple of days ago. Very nice! Didn't quite like it on the grille, so made a small bracket to mount on the rear license plate bracket--no holes in car body, of course. Here it is!
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.... my baby would never forgive me if I drill holes into her perfect body .....
Dieter,
how is your rear license plate attached to the chassis without mounting holes? Is it glued on or held in place magnetically? ;)
... besides normal position would be up front. ...
Well, what is "normal" to some is sacrilegious to others.
Friedrich Geiger would turn in his grave knowing that the iconic design of his SL grill was mutilated like this. 😢
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enriquegarcia: Sweet - that what I was thinking.
Well Done. Do you have a photo of the mount before mounting?
Idea for bracket.
https://www.etsy.com/listing/211083911/double-grille-badge-holder-for-mini?ref=pla_similar_listing_top-1
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Idea for bracket.
https://www.etsy.com/listing/211083911/double-grille-badge-holder-for-mini?ref=pla_similar_listing_top-1
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enriquegarcia,
My apologies, I missed the bracket.
Alfred,
It’s connected by the holes provided from the factory :) to each his own I prefer the front for the badge using the hardware provided by Mike :) Fredrich won’t mind he is fast asleep :)
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My bracket is a poor man's version of Ron's suggestion. I used a lumber connector plate and pop-riveted it to the license plate bracket. Yes, I had to drill two holes in the license plate bracket. Advantages of the lumber connector: it comes galvanized, was just the right size with no cutting, I already had it in my junk pile. Note: I used thread locking compound on the screws holding the badge and two small rubber strips to prevent rubbing against the car body.
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Didn't quite like it on the grille, so made a small bracket to mount on the rear license plate bracket--
[/quote
Good solution. I like it! :)
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My plan all along has been to mount the badge at the rear of the car. I'm not fond of blocking airflow to a radiator, or cleaning bugs off of any more stuff up front than is already there by design or necessity.
The mounting bracket is from British vehicle parts supplier Moss Motors, part #244-105. (As mentioned in another post on this subject, I have no relationship with Moss other than having bought parts from them for my various M.G.s for 46 years!) I did have to fiddle about with the placement a bit as the bracket as supplied centers the badges midway between the top and the bottom of the license plate, which locates the badges too low and close to the bumpers for my taste.
The Mini bracket by Artistic reflections on etsy.com that RonB found could also provide a similar look, locates the badges closer to the edge of a North American style license plate and mounts behind the license plate without modification. The Moss bracket has slots pre drilled for ease of badge attachment. The Artistic Reflections bracket must be custom drilled to mount the badges.
https://mossmotors.com/catalogsearch/result/?cat=&q=244105
https://www.etsy.com/listing/211083911/double-grille-badge-holder-for-mini?ref=pla_similar_listing_top-1
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Looks great Mike!
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Well DONE, nice! very low cost.$
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Made a license plate topper out of mine.
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A similar placement idea.
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I used the moss motors bracket to mount the badges on my 66'
i did not mount the bracket between the lisc plate and the mounting plate because it interfered with the lisc plate frame etc.
I installed the bracket behind the mounting plate. The bracket interfered with the screws that hold the mounting plate to the car so I ended up drilling 2 holes thru the moss motors bracket to make it work.
I will probably move the hawaii badge to the drivers side and the pagoda badge to the passenger side for aesthetic purposes. (to off set the chrome gas cap)
happy driving Matt
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For the time being my Badge will be shared between my 2 cars. I may later mount it on the Pagoda, however, for now, I just like to keep the bugs off it, besides one can read it better when located on the dash ... :)
Dieter
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Another placement - attached to the plate surround