Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Electrical and Instruments => Topic started by: pauldridge on December 10, 2008, 03:49:45
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wonder what the general consensus regarding appearance and value of cars with either Euro or US headlights installed?
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Euro and USA headlights have slightly different functions...take a look at the Headlight article in the Tech Manual for a description of various lights.
I have not found that having USA or Euro lights adds to the value of a specific car.
The Euro lights were created by the Mercedes style shop and were the lights originally intended for these cars. USA lights were born from US Federal safety regulations.
The price of a new or used Euro light can be quite a bit higher than the price of a USA light.
A number of USA owners have substituted Euro lights for the original USA lights.
I have owned cars with both USA and Euro lights. I prefer the uncluttered look of the Euro light.
Richard M, NYC
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There's a lot to consider here, most of it personal opinion and whether or not to keep things original.
If you have a US-spec car, with US sealed beam headlights, keep them. If you like "the look" of euro lights, take a photo of them and make a poster for your office and you can look at them all the time. ;) There's nothing more peculiar looking to purists, than Euro lights with US side markers or bumper overriders or other US-spec giveaways (or, vice-versa of course). MB may have designed the Euro look but they also designed the sealed beam enclosure too. It wasn't designed by the Feds; it was designed by the mfg to comply with sealed beam requirements existent for all manufacturers at the time.
Euro lights are ungodly expensive today. Crack a US headlight sealed beam, and for $10 at any auto parts store you have a new one. Crack a Euro lens, and go get a loan to replace it. Oh, nobody is lending any money at the moment, so you might have to wait! At today's prices you probably need a loan for any headlight door. I think I paid about $600 each--that was back in 1999. Mine were all cracked and broken.
If you have a Euro spec car, for goodness sake don't change to US. Keep it as it was delivered! If you import one, I don't believe you have to change it any longer as you might have some years ago.
If looks are secondary, and performance is first, I would offer that the US lights "pale" in comparison to the Euro. However you can purchase any number of aftermarket kits to replace the 7" sealed beam with a halogen setup. Cibie, Hella and others make these kits, I think they run around $100 and up. They generally are a bit flatter than a sealed beam, presenting a somewhat different look; offer bulb replacement (H4??) and significantly brighter in operation than traditional sealed beams. Lots of online retailers, and they even sell them at my local foreign auto parts store.
For a few $$ more than the $10 for a sealed beam, you can get what amounts to sealed H4 units. I have these (Sylvania I think) on my car, but I don't really drive much at night.
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There's nothing more peculiar looking to purists, than Euro lights with US side markers or bumper overriders or other US-spec giveaways (or, vice-versa of course).
However you can purchase any number of aftermarket kits to replace the 7" sealed beam with a halogen setup. Cibie, Hella and others make these kits, I think they run around $100 and up. They generally are a bit flatter than a sealed beam, presenting a somewhat different look; offer bulb replacement (H4??) and significantly brighter in operation than traditional sealed beams. Lots of online retailers, and they even sell them at my local foreign auto parts store.
On your two points quoted above...
With an "early" car, 230 or 250, you could fudge the Euro look if desired.
My car has the Cibie conversion. Very bright and functional. I also have Bosch H4s on my 190 SL. Again, very bright and functional.
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John,
Your right on the fudging--but it isn't limited to early cars (admittedly a bit easier though!). Some have closed up and removed side marker and reflectors holes, removed over-riders and filled and replated bumpers, etc. even on newer cars to achieve the smooth Euro look. All depends on the look you are trying to achieve, I suppose. I actually added mine; the new headlight doors had the connection for markers, so I removed the reflectors and added the markers during the restoration. You can't tell much of course unless it is night time, they present the same general look (the look frowned upon by Euro-purists) except one has a bulb in it! To me they are all beautiful, US or Euro, early or late.
In the world of customizing, it is common to remove many external things. I've seen 1957 Tbirds and others with the door handles removed (some kind of electric thing with a hidden switch added); dechroming is common on Detroit iron of the era, too.
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I vote for the Euro lights, even with the US side reflectors. I'm in the market for a pair...
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I'm neutral regarding the headlights but have a big preference against the ugly side marker lights.
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I strongly prefer the Euro headlights on my American spec car and I believe the choice is a personal one. (I have been known to offend purists on more than one occassion.) Based upon Mike's comment, I checked the picture of my car in my office and it also has the Euro headlights.
Euro lights with halogen bulbs are much brighter than the standard US sealed beam headlights. The US sealed beam headlights are easily switched with the Euro headlights. There are no alterations required so you can change to the appropriate headlight when you sell your car in order to get top dollar.
Ted 1969 280SL US spec car w/ Euro headlights
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It's a personal choice, but I'll say this—the thin plastic rim at the top of the US headlight surround is prone to break, so beware. The US-spec headlights are expensive & fragile whereas the Euro lights are just plain expensive.
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It's a personal choice, but I'll say this—the thin plastic rim at the top of the US headlight surround is prone to break, so beware. The US-spec headlights are expensive & fragile whereas the Euro lights are just plain expensive.
That plastic will crack just looking at it. The Euro's are solid glass, yes?
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That plastic will crack just looking at it. The Euro's are solid glass, yes?
Correct, Michael. My advice is to be on the safe side and avoid playing any Memorex cassettes in your Becker Mexico cassette player. :-)
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My experience is that the European headlight glass covers are pretty crack-prone too >:( Mine cracked pretty soon after installation...
Peter
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Correct, Michael. My advice is to be on the safe side and avoid playing any Memorex cassettes in your Becker Mexico cassette player. :-)
It's only a Europa, no cassette!! ;)
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I have imported my car from California to Croatia (Europe). It is not a w113, but it is a w111 coupe (220SE) with USA headlights. I strongly suggest USA version of headlights over European (I have both). Maybe it is not so obvious in hot and dry climate like CA, but old European lights tend to get rusty and blury, esspecialy if they have to be turned on all the time while driving (like in Croatia). With USA lights You always have a new mirror, and it always shines like a new one. So I prefer USA version if we talk about function.
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Regarding the thin plastic rim at the top of the US headlights, Gernold gave me the tip to put silicon caulking along the inside of that rim to lessen the potential for breakage.
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http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330300451586#ht_500wt_1234
Check these ones out on ebay and look at the pictures of the same car, one with US and one with Euro lights. You can be the judge. I myself have had both versions and functionally speaking the Euro lights are brighter than all the US version lamps except for maybe the H4 halogens. Yes, you have to make sure the light buckets are not dull/tarnished on the inside and the lens clear. I also like how the Euro lights glow when you switch on just the parking lights. As far as ease of blemishing, the US version takes the cake. The plastic housing is almost always chipped, cracked, dull or all of the above. I think the line of the car looks nicer with Euro lights and if the US federal laws were different, MB never would have put 7" round headlights on that car.
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I vote Euro look!
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My euro car has american lamps.. I found a crack on the "door" as its known in the USA. So have ordered a new bosch unit for around $300 delivered to the UK.
This will see me for a while but im also beginning to prefer the Euro lamps and so am after a set.. Although they are going for silly money! I dont think I could justify spending almost £1500 that most dealers want for a new set.
Once I have the headlamps, i just need to remove the front wing markers and my car will be euro again as it left the factory.
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In the beginning I liked the Eurolook most as it was how the car was intended.
Now that I have a US car, I think the car looks "happiere" with the US lights.
I would not change the look of a US car to a Euro. But I would change a Eurocar which have US headlights back to Eurolight.
I do believe that a car should look like what it is. Eiether a Euro or US spec car.
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I noticed also last time, when I was for 5weeks holidays in the Netherlands, that both headlights
(American version) on my green 280 sl 1972 were cracked. Passengerside the whole plastic/glass
top is gone. Driverside is just cracked. Headlights are sealed beams.
I checked the site for spare parts http://www.pagodenteile.de/16.htm and if you have to replace
both it does cost you an arm and a leg.
Also during the 1200km testdriving in Holland I got stuck beside the highway. >:(
The automatic shifting rod came loose from the selector rod. The plastic bussing, which connects
these two components was complete integrated. We had to repair it with a plastic thin garden
hose and a tighrap. Anybody knows were I can get the plastic bushing. Thanks.
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Van Dijk, Lisserbroek sells the bushings. For details check our vendor list: http://www.sl113.org/wiki/Suppliers/Start
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heres a pic for this thread as i changed mine to Euro today
(http://home.btconnect.com/whitleford/whittleford/cars/headlights.jpg)