Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => General Discussion => Topic started by: usurp on October 05, 2024, 04:18:59
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Hey guys, I'm new here, just signed up and hoping to get some feedback from people more experienced in the Pagoda than I am. Late last year I had an opportunity to buy a 250SL Pagoda, it's my favorite color on the car, exterior and interior and price was kinda reasonable but a few things concerned me so I backed out. Now I've started thinking about the car again and so wanted to see with you guys if my concerns were big issues or superficial fixes.
Here are photos of the car that mostly highlight some of my concerns https://imgur.com/a/TZ4BdOR
So I'm worried about a few things.
- the history of the car is not very clear. Owner purchased it from Lebanon around 20 years ago maybe. Looks to be of US origin since the speedometer is in MPH
- car looks to have been painted and doesn't seem like it was a good job (found some paint on the chrome for example)
- the front hood cover doesn't open or close easily without hitting the body, could be just a minor alignment issue
- the owner hasn't removed the hard top in over a decade, so no idea about the condition of the soft top and if it needs changing
- there seems to be rust issues but hard to tell. you can see in the photos that the rust has made it's way out from under the paint in some areas
I think I can convince the owner to sell the car for around $65K, but not really sure if its worth it, there aren't many Pagodas that come up for sale where I live let alone in the color combo I want.
Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
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It’s dusty and a good clean would help it… but at least you know it’s not had a blow-over for a quick “I’m shiny” sale
The rust in the trunk is surface based so not a major worry.
The rust at the cill/bottom of the wheel arch is more a worry, as that suggests the cills may be rotten. It’s fixable - many of us here have had to do it - but comes at a cost.
Oil around the oil filler cap on the head cover doesn’t inspire confidence either. Do you know if the car runs?
At a guess, there’ll be some perished/dried out rubber and seals around the car - generally available and fixable.
The question is, while $65 isn’t cheap, if that’s what’s available, that makes it cheaper than if you had 4 to choose from. You could spend $10_15k less on a US car but not see the car/gauge its issues and be in a worse place and have import etc to deal with.
Being in the UK, that’s at the cheaper end of pricing, and likely more solid than I’d get here in a wet/salty roads climate: in the US you may get a “better” car for that money but any would likely need work.
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Looks like a fairly decent "daily driver" to me.
If the rear chassis rails are not rotten I'd say that car is likely to give you happy motoring.
It's what I would call an "honest" car; not what we call in the UK a polished turd......
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Looks good. Buy it, have fun and never look back. Rarely will you get all the boxes ticked color/ mechanics/ body/ price.
Believe me, the smile this car will bring you EVERY time you drive it, will more than justify your decision.
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it looks pretty decent to me.
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@usurp - I note you just joined, so wanted to highlight that you are fortunate to have received such quick responses from some seriously qualified posters here on the forum. Accordingly, perhaps try to get a bit more detail on the car from the seller.
You are clear eyed as to what you are getting with this car - you not expecting pristine, just not an unrecoverable rust heap. These responses should give you some confidence - good luck.
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I'd say buy it, get it running properly, clean it up, and drive it 'til the road wears out. The smile on your face and every one who sees you will make your days for years to come!
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wow, thank you everyone for the responses, I was honestly expecting a stay away, avoid at all cost kind of responses but I’m glad to see that the Pagoda isn’t as scary a car as I expected it to be. I had to deal with plenty of rust issues on my Datsun so not really afraid of rust but just expected the SL to be a different story at least.
Car runs, there is a bit of a fuel smell but that’s about it. The owner doesn’t drive it much anymore but he has his driver start the car and drive it around the block once a week to keep it running. Will have to go back and talk to the owner, maybe I can bring down the price a bit.
Thanks again!
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Are you able to pay for a full engine rebuild and/or major rust repair? Without an evaluation by a professional or particularly experienced enthusiast, you're not sure what you're getting into. You say there's a sloppy paint job, maybe it's hiding sloppy rust repair? All that oil on the valve cover and intake manifold hints at blow-by, worn piston rings, generally worn engine. Age old saying is 'buyer beware'. Get it checked out by someone who knows this vintage MBs.
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I would be very concerned about covered up rust. May be fine but have someone familiar with these cars check it out first
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Some photos of the underside show quite a bit of serious rust peeking through. There's lots more underneath.
We do have recent stories of fresh enthusiasts who have run into major challenges, I would personally be sceptical of this car, and at least be prepared for some major work to be done.
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Some photos of the underside show quite a bit of serious rust peeking through. There's lots more underneath.
We do have recent stories of fresh enthusiasts who have run into major challenges, I would personally be sceptical of this car, and at least be prepared for some major work to be done.
One should also consider the source. The new member is in Kuwait City. This is decidedly a different place in which to have work done, source parts, etc. than say UK, Western Europe, or North America.
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I am sorry, I have a different opinion than some of the experts here...
I think this car is a rotten through quickly painted trap. It would be a project car perhaps for $30k considering that it requires a total restauration with lots of body and chassis work.
But I am not an expert, so probably there is something I do not see. Well, she looks fairly complete - it is an advantage.
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I hate to be a Debby downer, but I agree with Pawel, absolutely everything needs touching and I could foresee spending quite a bit of money. If one is going to extensively restore a car and do rust remediation and whatnot, I don't see how the color combo matters. Any perceived decline in value from changing the color of a more solid better project is surely lesser than extensive cancer removal and repair on this one. I'd be curious about the costs of importing a more solid vehicle from Europe or the US. Over here a great car can still be had for that asking price. Then again, I guess the costs of a workable base have really gone up in the last few years. I'm curious what that white 280SL on BaT will bring. If anywhere close to 65k, then I guess this isn't so bad. I'll just ask this, OP: do you intend to make a major restoration? Would you die of angst if you couldn't use the car for 2-3 years and it was just costing you money? Do you like projects in general? Do you have a good network of professionals near you for the things you can't do yourself or are you cool with sending things to Poland or Turkey or Germany?
In the US, I could see one judiciously spending another 40k or so to have the car taken to a #2, some might spend more and others less depending on their capabilities and depending on what is wrong (axle rebuilds, engine rebuilds, injection system rebuilds are the three really costly things that come to mind). Interiors don't cost that much, relatively speaking, nor do body panels or most trim and other things. Dumb things like the grille star are costly but you have that. If you're cool with being around 100k all-in, then great.
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I say, take your $65K and look for/wait for, a better deal, perhaps on BaT, etc..I recently saw similar ones to this, same color and in better shape, for less money there.
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Michael is correct - @usurp is in Kuwait City so options are limited so the price and condition parameters have to shift somewhat. Even BaT cars have well hidden faults, at least @usurp can see and prod this vehicle.
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I agree with Pawel and Jack , the car looks like a rust bucket cover up to me too.
If you can poke around the sills with a screw driver and see what falls off.
My 2 cents.
jz
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I too fully agree with Pawel. I would avoid this car. Repairing major rust issues on a W113 is a far more challenging and costly issue than fixing rust on a Datsun. Wait for a better car. They are out there. Yes, they might be a bit more expensive, but you’ll save tens of thousands over the long haul.
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So, usurp, did you move forward with the car? See it and decide for against?
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After reading the last batch of comments I backed out. I realized it would make sense to get one from abroad that is in better condition and would be similar in price, maybe slightly more but considering the amount of have to spend on this one it would still be cheaper I think
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USURP........... did you see my personal message to you?
Don
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This car is waaaay over priced at 65K.
Looks tarted up. Certain to have lots of bondo and patches.
All keep in mind that a hood bonnet that doesn't close can be a can worms in many ways. The captive caged nuts can be a major issue. I have seen this many times.
Do yourself a favor and look at better cars.
I wish you luck.
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I agree with all about looking at another one. Your headlights from the side appear to be European version and not N.A. The instrument cluster looks European also and the speedo may have been replaced as the MPH are cheaper than a KPH ones.
I am currently doing a full restoration and it is not cheap. Approximately between 40-50k as all your seals, rubber, and fasteners that are complely corroded will have to be replaced as we) some that may break when removed. That is a big expense to fix. I see some bondo covering some areas which means a lot of expensive she metal repairs.
Keep looking