Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Electrical and Instruments => Topic started by: Leester on July 02, 2022, 17:26:49
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I'm installing euro lights on my US 280SL and so far all seems to work fine with one exception. I've looked through the Tech Manual and clearance light postings and don't see any help on this issue, but of course, could have missed it.
On euro lights, the clearance lights (small bulb next to fogs) are supposed to light the left clearance light with one click of the light switch ccw. With 2 clicks ccw the left clearance light should light. Both require ignition switch in off position.
I get nothing at 1 click ccw and nothing with 2 clicks ccw.
Other factors: [1] Side marker lights were deleted when body work was done. [2] I used a US wiring harness from Rhode Island Wiring and transferred over the connectors. [3] Only working on headlights at the moment - taillights not connected.
Anyone have any ideas? TIA Lee
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The headlight switch may be the cause of this. See: https://www.sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=23375.msg167223#msg167223
Meyer
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I would first probe the terminals on the light switch to see if you have power in the CCW positions. Then check the wires from the terminals to the lamp sockets to see if they are actually connected and conducting current to the consumers. I suspect a harness mismatch is at the root of your failure and that some bridging will be necessary to power the lamps.
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Dear friend
Check that you have at the 6 pin connector a green/black wire on the left side and a solid green wire on the same position on the right side
Those are the leads that are connected on the main light switch to PaL and PaR terminals, responsible of that functionality you described when switching the main light switch counterclockwise to the first and second click.
Check what is connected to “PaL” and “PaR” into the main light switch
Best regards
Eng Leonardo Peterssen
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Thanks all for your replies. Not dismissing the other replies, but I think Mr. Peterssen may have found the issue - nothing is connected at the PaL and PaR terminals on the main light switch. I DO have the six pin connector. Black/white for turnsignal; gray/black for park; gray for fog; white/green which I think would power the side marker lights (which no longer exist) and brown for ground.
Is there a way I could use the white/greens to power up the clearance lights?
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I have a 1971 Euro 280SL. I am not familiar with the term "clearance light". What is it?
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Hello Mike, the clearance lights (also called night clearance lights) are the two small bulbs adjacent to the fog lights on the euro headlight units. I believe there is a corresponding light in the taillight units on each side. If all is working correctly, with the ignition off, when you turn the light switch one click to the left (ccw) the left side clearance lights are supposed to light. One more click to the left (ccw) and the right side clearance lights are supposed to light.
I understand that in some European countries especially on narrow streets, if you park there overnight, you are supposed to activate the clearance lights. Left side for European countries, right side if you're in UK. I think I read all this in the Tech Manual. I don't have first hand knowledge of the reason for the clearance lights and maybe someone with more experience can weigh in.
Lee
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O.K., we call them "Parking Lights".
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Parking lights are what I have always heard them referred to - and makes sense. You park the car in a dark place where you want it to be seen at night - parking lights.
So in installing my Euro headlights, I went to the tech manual and found this picture that referred to "Clearance lights".
I thought having all the Euro bulbs working as described in the tech manual would be nice, but I am coming to believe that its not really worth the effort to connect the "clearance lights". All the other bulbs are working fine. I am guessing that the US wiring harness is just different enough from a Euro harness that its not worth the trouble. When I run out of other things to do, I might revisit but that's probably a good ways off. Thanks to all who replied. Lee
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Just for future readers - we should not leave this thread with folks reading that these one sided (not four corners) lights are same as parking lights as they are not.
I don’t know what each country calls them, but in my experience, the lights that Leester is referencing, where they only illuminate on one side and not all four corners are specifically used for parking on dark village or country side streets in France and probably for other European countries. These are not parking lights. Speaking specifically to the French driving code (I have a French drivers license and had to learn the code years ago), these were called Position Lights in France. They were to be illuminated if parked on a dark street. The lights are to be low consumption so battery is not drained overnight as lights are required to be on all night — and only on one side, not all corners.
Some may call these Clearance lights, but the term Clearance lights is also used for trucks to mark the extreme corners of the vehicle.
In any case, the single sided low consumption lights are not the same as parking lights.
Note added: based on the manual link 66Nblu posted, the manual describes these one sided lights as parking lights left and parking lights right. However the manual also calls the four corner lights as Standing Lights (as of 280sl manual). The distinction is that this clearance light function only turns in the two lights on one side and the Standing lights turns on all four corners plus a few other lights.
Just to keep this clear.
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I have found that the sources that describe these lights, the "one sided lights" as Kampala refers to them, to be very confusing. That's the reason that I showed the photo from the Tech Manual referring to them as "clearance lights". Since the "one sided lights" are used in different European countries maybe translations to English get confusing.
Thank you Kampala for the clarification and yes, its the "one sided lights" or "Position Lights" that I was referring to as "clearance lights" that I was trying to connect. Lee
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In addition to Kampala's explanation also look at the information shown in your owner's manual explaining the headlight switch.
Or look here: https://www.sl113.org/wiki/Electrical/Lightswitch#Headlight
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Thank you 66. I have also read your earlier posts which were very helpful. I've also found a reference to "standing lights" but without an explanation. Seems the different lights have lots of names. Lee
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I am going by my personal knowledge and experience with German cars. Both made and used there. There is "Standlicht" - Standing Light, which is a four corner light, low watt bulb front and rear. The same bulbs are used a "Parklicht" - parking lights either left or right by operating the light switch in a different manner. Some time the Parklicht is also called a Standlicht by referring to left or right side. To back up my story, here is a copy of the page of my original 1971 280SL owners manual in German, describing the function of the light switch
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My thoughts are that for the US market Pagodas the wiring was revised to not have these lights operated, because of US laws did not require. I lived in Germany for several years and they are required. My Pagoda is European specs and these lights work on my SL
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My thoughts are that for the US market Pagodas the wiring was revised to not have these lights operated, because of US laws did not require. I lived in Germany for several years and they are required. My Pagoda is European specs and these lights work on my SL
Every Mercedes-Benz that I have, six in total from 1955 through 1985, all US delivery, have these lights fully functional.
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To add another point of data. My 1970 (1969 build) 280 SL - the side lights do not operate with the clicks to the left.
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I found this info in the owners manual. Maybe helpful for this conversation....
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i was always taught to call them clearance lights, to be used, left or right, when the car is parked with one corner or another kinda hanging out in harms way. very low wattage, def. diff than park lights, more similar to city lights on some cars
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i was always taught to call them clearance lights, to be used, left or right, when the car is parked with one corner or another kinda hanging out in harms way. very low wattage, def. diff than park lights, more similar to city lights on some cars
Well, if these are not "parking" lights, what are the parking lights that are definitely different?
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I found this info in the owners manual. Maybe helpful for this conversation....
That is the picture that I posted a few posts up.....
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That is the picture that I posted a few posts up.....
Not quite, Mike, take another look: 🤓! Did you now notice the line he marked in yellow?
"Positions in counterclockwise direction have no function."
I was surprised and checked the owners manuals that I have and none of them show this info.
Would be interesting to know how many here have this manual, when it was printed and whether it is an original one or a reprint.
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Cannot find the print date of my manual. My car was produced in Oct/Nov 1970 if that helps.
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Looks like you have a US version car, correct?
What does the manual show on the back cover page?
Here are examples.
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His photo shows an English language page with no instructions pertaining to the positions to the left. Your photo shows a German language page with complete instructions pertaining to
??? What are you trying to convey?
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None of the above. And Yes I have USA version.
Mine: 1135841796.280 SL.USA-Ausgabe B. Same as yours with the exception of the "B" instead of "A/1" (3rd example down from top). An
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Thanks Lew, that helps a lot!
Perhaps Jonny B has that version (113 584 1796) in his collection?
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It just happens I do have 17 96, ending with B. The notation for the light switch is as the one mentioned with the yellow line, "Positions in counterclockwise direction have no function."
However, I cannot unequivocally say that this is an original manual. A long time before I purchase my 280 SL (from the second owner) someone had broken into the car, and took, of all things, the book packet.
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Mike and Alfred: I have removed my posts. It turns out that I was the one who was confused! ;^)
Alfred, the post you quoted was incomplete. I got up in mid-sentence to go out to the garage to look see what the light switch instructions look like in my 230SL owners guide, got a phone call and drove off to meet a friend for dinner. It appears that if you leave a reply in progress unattended too long it times out and self-posts!
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Confusion is understandable since DBAG has not been consistent in its use of descriptive terminology. During the 1950s and early 1960s these were called "parking lights" in the 300 SL manuals. Come 1964 and 1965, in the 220 SE Coupe and 220 S manuals, they had become "clearance lights." By 1972, in the 280 SE 4.5 manual, they were "standing lights" and were called "standing lamps" in the 1985 380 SL manual, which is the newest M-B that I have. An interesting note regarding these lights in the 1964 220 SE Coupe manual states, "In Germany permitted only in residential districts."
As previously mentioned, the parking/clearance/standing light function was and is fully functional on my cars, including a 1969 Porsche, all of which were constructed for the USA, notwithstanding that I took factory delivery of the 220 SE Coupe in July, 1964.
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Please consider that MB is a German company. Original component and function description was in German and made sense for that country. Translation quality has always varied and probably improved over the decades. Do you remember the first Japanese model kits and their English assembly instructions?