Pagoda SL Group

W113 Pagoda SL Group => Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes => Topic started by: mrfatboy on July 30, 2020, 19:09:23

Title: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 30, 2020, 19:09:23

What is the F.I.P.i Project?

Fuel Injection Pump interactive.

Several weeks ago I was running out of projects to do while being stuck at home during the quarantine.  I started to take on the challenge of creating an interactive FIP simulator designed to educate and experiment with all the adjustments of the FIP.  It also simulates all the problems our FIP can have and how the CO is affected by each adjustment.

It is currently in an early beta version but working.  There may be bugs and glitches in extreme settings.
I quickly slapped together pictures and info from our forum and would really like to polish and add more helpful info.

I am looking for contributors (forum members) to help with providing pictures, technical writing, and suggestions to make the app more helpful and correct.  Please PM me if you have any ideas or would like to contribute.

The app only works on Desktop computers currently.  Make sure you make your browser window big to see everything.
I look forward to your comments.  If anything, it has occupied my time for a bit.  :)

Give it a try . It's fun to play with :)

F.I.P.i can be found here:
https://www.sl113.org/fip/index.html

F.I.P.i is located in the technical manual here:
https://www.sl113.org/wiki/Fuel/Injection

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: kampala on July 30, 2020, 19:41:40

Fantastic!

Quite Ambitious.     Trying to make the "split" work just for fun.   

I think this will be of great help and interest.   

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 30, 2020, 20:12:32

Thanks. Emulating the split linkage test was tough.  :D  Still needs more work but not bad for a first try.

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: stickandrudderman on July 30, 2020, 20:21:33

That's brilliant, well done.
An idea: have a link by each label that when clicked shows a picture of that item. Is that possible?

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 30, 2020, 20:28:57

Quote from: stickandrudderman on July 30, 2020, 20:21:33

That's brilliant, well done.
An idea: have a link by each label that when clicked shows a picture of that item. Is that possible?

Very possible and exactly the feedback I’m looking for.  Currently if you click the “info” buttons some pictures are provided but as I said I just slapped them together.  More work needs to be done with the content.  Any contributors out there? You will get a credit 🤣🤣🤣👍.

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: ja17 on July 31, 2020, 05:31:23

Amazing, I love it!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Paul & Dolly on July 31, 2020, 07:31:43

Brilliant,

I have really enjoyed the last hour with this, wonderful learning aid .

Thanks

Paul

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Garry on July 31, 2020, 12:33:41

Great fun playing around and seeing the effect of changes.


Really like it and info pix and comments good.


Garry

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: CharlieSierra on July 31, 2020, 13:33:23

Fantastic - Well done!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Pawel66 on July 31, 2020, 14:01:16

It is truly fantastic!

To restart after you make it stall, you press Pause, correct?

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 31, 2020, 14:09:33

Pause or unpause - just pauses/unpauses current plotting.

Start - starts the engine. Continues warmup
Stop -  stops engine.

Reset - Resets graph and thermostat to zero. Essentially a cold start. Reset does not reset other settings that you might have changed so you can see the effect at a cold start.

You can reset the individual components with their own “reset” button.

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 31, 2020, 14:26:18

Also check out the “settings” button. You can turn off the sound effects and the engine alerts.

Turning off engine alerts lets you continuously adjust all the settings and plot graph even though the engine should not run theoretically.

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Pawel66 on July 31, 2020, 15:54:07

I started the engine. Leaned it too much. Needed to restart - Pause worked, i think.

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Pawel66 on July 31, 2020, 15:55:28

Also: this is for manual, right? If it were for automatic, gear in should open throttle and fuel a bit, correct?

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Pawel66 on July 31, 2020, 16:03:31

Also: worth mentioning which shims are oval (10 on drawing) and which are round (5 on drawing) as some of us have an issue with it.

Also: perhaps worth mentioning that shim 6 needs to be always left there so that push action is transmitted down on valve.

Also: perhaps worth mentioning shims under BC are (ODxIDxTH) 18x14xXXmm.

As you see, if you look for criticism, you can count on me.  :) :)

This is a fantastic device!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 31, 2020, 16:20:43

Great input.
I wrote the code to be a generic transmission but I can add a manual/auto transmission setting. If auto is selected it can automatically adjust throttle a little. Does that work?

My technical writing is sub par🤣 I’m looking contributors to write a short descriptions and maybe photos that could be added to the INFO button on each component. Also add a link to a post in the forum that best describes the problem in more detail.

For example, I seem to remember Stickandrudderman(I think) did a YouTube video demonstrating the split linkage test. I could easily add that link in the INFO. I can’t find it now but please send and I will add.

I would really like this to be a community project to make it even better. It will also give me motivation to continue improving it.

I also wanted add relay and tts components.

Keep the comments coming and please send me content to add . Let’s all make it better👍👍

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Desertpagoda on July 31, 2020, 16:28:56

This is cool as ****!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: wwheeler on July 31, 2020, 22:00:35

That blows my mind that you were able to do this! Real candy for us tuning junkies.

Question on the CSV activate. Is that a manual activation and does it spritz before the engine cranks over? I assume CSV will also operate automatically given the proper conditions? I have one of the manual buttons installed.

Another possible variable is to be able to change the ambient temperature so that the engine can start in both hot Texas heat and then also in the frozen upper Midwest. maybe that is too complicated.

Unbelievable job!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 31, 2020, 22:06:48

👍

The CSV activates as it should now. I added the manual activate button just to show what happens to the CO if you did it manually. Click it a few time and it stalls the engine🤣

I will add the ambient temp suggestion to the list. I need to think how to implement that 🤔

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: wwheeler on July 31, 2020, 22:19:40

Interesting that you show the mixture, as it gets close to full warm, goes lean. Mine certainly does that and is noticeable to me. It slows the idle speed more than this simulation and maybe I can increase oval shims a tad to minimize the "lean period". If I add or subtract the oval shims in the simulation, it doesn't seem to affect the lean period. Should it?

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on July 31, 2020, 22:37:52

The basic shape of the warm up graph is definitely correct. From cold start the rpms raise due to more fuel and air added by the WRD.

As the car warms up the WRD reduces the extra fuel & air it provides thus reducing the rpms toward their normal level.

The WRD shuts off the extra fuel first. The air  shuts off soon after and that’s why you see that dip before it totally shuts off.

I can see if some one turns off the car and restarts the car during that lean period AND the starting fuel solenoid is inoperable there would be hard starting issues.

Now I have to see if my model represents that. Never checked🤣🤣🤣

EDIT
Increasing oval shims should reduce the depth of the “lean dip” AND increase the amplitude of the warmup curve. 

I need to check if my model does that. I remember working on it but I think it’s “in progress”. Something to do 🤣

Good catches👍

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: wwheeler on August 01, 2020, 00:20:17

I wonder why they allowed the mixture to go lean for that period? Doesn't makes sense to me. At one point, I looked closely at the air passages in the housing and they are stair stepped. Three steps if I recall. As the air valve (piston) slides down, the width of the steps decrease (ie allowing a lower air flow). If you had a small file and lots of time, I suppose you could make your own "curve". But that is getting too much into the weeds.

Anyway, great job and it is a wonderful learning tool. I wish SL113 had this when I was trying to figure this stuff out!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on August 01, 2020, 00:26:55

The only theory on the “lean dip” that I have is that it was designed to “clean” the spark plugs after the overly rich mixture during warm up where they get sooty. 🤷‍♂️

Other theories are welcome. 🤣

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: hansr433 on August 04, 2020, 09:15:35

Amazing project. Congrats. 

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Anosh on August 05, 2020, 13:33:44

Superb

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: Rick Katucki on August 05, 2020, 16:31:31

What a great tool. Just Wow!

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: dirkbalter on August 05, 2020, 17:07:59

This is great.

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: mrfatboy on August 14, 2020, 14:27:44

Thanks for all the great responses.

A new version of FIPi (vb.04) has been uploaded to our tech manual.

https://www.sl113.org/wiki/Fuel/Injection
Direct FIPi link is here:

https://www.sl113.org/fip/index.html

What's new in FIPi?

- Viewport
   -When hovering over controls, close up pictures of the device now show (Thanks StickandRudderman for the idea :) )

- Starting aids
   -Starting aids have now been added and can be controlled. When car starting,  the aids have status indicator lights.

- New Settings
   -Switch between CO & AFR displays.
        - WRD Alerts in settings
          When "ON" you alerted during significant WRD events

- Info on what equipment is used to measure CO & AFR

- Fully controllable WRD

- Problematic senarios
   - Leaky CSV
   - Stuck WRD valve
   - Lazy WRD Tstat
   - Full customization

- Realistic CO curve (Actually pulled from my car)
- Many under the hood improvements (pun intended)
- Many bug fixes (Still more to squash :) )

There are still many more refinements and special cases that I might have missed or that are needed.   I am still looking for any and all feedback. Especially if you would like to contribute. 

Enjoy :)

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: JamesL on August 14, 2020, 16:35:21

What a brilliant idea and excellently executed!

Linkage tour next? ;)

Title: Re: The F.I.P.i Project
Post by: jeblack123 on August 23, 2020, 00:35:00

Impressive idea! Outstanding execution!


Eddie