Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes => Topic started by: col320ce on July 11, 2020, 13:54:25
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These need doing and I've bever done this before. I've read up on it but I can't really work out if I really need some special tools. Is there an idiots guide to this somewhere and a recommendation on whether special tools are required?
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I'm in the midst of changing the front bearings and I have 2 potentially stupid questions:
1. I assume the outer bearing is tapped out the front of the hub and the inner bearing tapped out the back of the hub?
2. When I tap the new bearing in is there an obvious end point when they are seated correctly?
Thanks!
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Hi Colin,
1. Yes
2. There is a shoulder they locate against. You should notice the sound as you tap, it goes "dull" when the outer race is fully located.
Regards
Peter
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I thought I’d do a quick write up on changing the front wheel bearings. It’s a 250SE/Cp but I’m sure it’s very similar to the W113. If there are any mistakes or additions please let me know...
Remove the wheel
Remove the brake caliper – Disconnect the break line (11mm) then bend back the tabs on the locking plate and remove the 2 19mm bolts. Just twist it a little to move the pads in a little to get over the lip on the disc. Pop a glove finger onto the brake line to stop contamination getting in.
Remove the cover/cap off the wheel hub. There is a puller for this but most use a screwdriver/wooden mallet arrangement.
Undo the hex bolt on the clamping nut and unscrew the clamping nut
Remove the washer
Remove the hub. This came off without any trouble
Clean the spindle and take the hub to the bench
Remove both outer races of the inner and outer roller cages – I used a brass block (something softer than the steel so you don’t damage the hub). Tapping it at 12 o’clock then 6 o’clock repeatedly gets them out.
Retain the puller ring (directly under the seal on the inside part of the hub).
Clean the 2 outer races as these are used to tap the new ones in.
Remove the disk from the hub if you’re changing this at the same time. These are on tight and I used “Loctitite seal and release” and a breaker bar to get them off. I held the hub in a bench vice ... you can also attach it to the wheel (off the car) and have someone stand on the tire. Put the new one on – 112Nm torque and use loctite on the threads.
Tap the outer race of both the inner and outer bearings. The ‘fat’ side goes in first. Best not to lube these as they go in in case it encourages them to move when driving. Use the old bearing race to tap it in. You’ll see that I used the bearing as well on the inside race as the hub got in the way before it was fully seated. The tone produced when hitting changes when they are fully seated.
Pack the bearings with the Mercedes high speed wheel grease. I measured out the recommended quantities (45-55g) which ended up being pretty much the exact amount you will use packing the bearings.
Put the inner on in first followed by the Puller Ring. Make sure the puller ring is the correct way around. Then tap the Seal in place.
Apply a little lube to the seal surface. The BBB says use Molykote paste.
Clean the disc with break cleaner
Pop it back on the spindle, put the outer bearing in, put a new washer on and screw the clamping nut back on until it stops. Back it off so that the washer can be only just moved by hand and tighten the clamping nut bolt.
Put the cap back on (with 20-25g of grease in it), make sure the copper grounding thing is present.
Put the caliper back on. Tighten to 112Nm and bend up the tabs on the locking plate. Re attach the brake fluid line.
Change the pads if required
Bleed the brakes
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Colin,
Excellent. A very good contribution to the forum.
Two comments from me.
1. Retain the puller ring. YES, as these are 100 Euros plus tax each !! I am also not sure what they really do as so many people have commented here that they are missing on their cars.
2. In order to break the bolts holding the disc (rotor for the USA folks) to the hub you can bolt the hub to the spare wheel, lay the wheel on the ground and then have someone put their weight on the wheel. That worked for me.
Regards
Peter
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Good infos here ... ;) i'll use your pics if i need a bearing replacement Thank's for posting
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Colin,
One more comment. I know that some people do not recommend lubricating the outer races to help get them in. You don't want these turning in operation. I took mine to a garage and they removed the old race and installed the new.
I never actually saw how they did it though !!
Regards
Peter
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Thanks for the info Peter on the greasing of the outer races... I'll edit the write up...
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Colin,
The technical manual doesn't have much detail on wheel bearings. I suggest you take it up with your fellow Aussie Garry on how to input your article into this area.
Regards
Peter
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Great idea... I'll pm him soon.
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Colin,
If you do manage to get the article together here is a picture showing how to deal with the bolts holding the discs to the hubs.
It really does make it easy.
Also it is recommended to use loctite on reassembly of these bolts.
Regards
Peter
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Hi Peter
I'll update it with the picture and loctite. I'll pull mine off and add loctite ... I debated it at the time.
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Colin, great tutorial since I am forced to replace the bearings right now. See Exhibit A.
A little rant about Mercedes. I decided to order a kit from them since the EPC showed it coming with a hub, Exhibits B and C. Euro120 later I ended up with Exhibit D-H. Bearings made in Japan, the rest are cheap stampings, the dust cap does not fit and no hub. I could have ordered a kit with SKF or FAG German-made bearings for a third-less to half of what I paid Mercedes. Just plain highway robbery.
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More photos. Sorry, forum system not being helpful.
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Hans,
Do not lose this part - it's the famous puller ring`. Costs more than 100 euros.
Peter
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Hans,
I bought Febi Bilstein wheel bearing kit "05422". This all worked out fine apart from the hub cap. Also if we are being picky the cap head screw which is used to "lock" the big split nut which is fitted on the outside of the stub axle wasn't correct either. My old one was fine.
For the hub cap you need Meredes Part A 120 330 01 57. That is a copper coloured part which will fit your hub.
I still have the old SKF bearings in my garage and if you want the part numbers I will gladly give them to you.
Peter
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Hans,
Do not lose this part - it's the famous puller ring`. Costs more than 100 euros.
Peter
Thanks - why the high cost?
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nobody knows....the Benz Dr has previously suggested that whoever sets the prices is probably smoking crack !
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Hi,
I've added Col's documentation to the Technical Manual.
...WRe
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Well done WRe based on Col's documentation. I cleaned it up a little and we now have collaboratively added a very useful section to the Tech Manual: https://www.sl113.org/wiki/WheelsTires/Bearings
Peter
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Thanks for cleaning Peter!
...Wolfgang
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nobody knows....the Benz Dr has previously suggested that whoever sets the prices is probably smoking crack !
I can't take complete credit for that. It was actually Tim Kidder from K&K Mfg who said that in a letter to MB. So I stole it, but it was stolen well.
Has anyone priced a set of ignition points lately? They used to be 10 - 15 dollars and now they're 50 plus and all in one go. More like meth or LSD. ( not that I'd know about either )
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Colin,
If you do manage to get the article together here is a picture showing how to deal with the bolts holding the discs to the hubs.
It really does make it easy.
Also it is recommended to use loctite on reassembly of these bolts.
Regards
Peter
Just a couple ofpoints here: MB buys their bearings from FAG, but SKF or NTN bearings are probably just as good. MB puts the part in their box and doubles the price - YMMV.
I don't lube the outer race before assembly and I don't use lock tight on the hub screws. They have lock washers and are torqued down to about 80 - 85 ft-lbs so they won't come loose.
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Hi Dan,
Regarding the disc to hub fixing...I got that from the BBB (for W111). It states to replace the lock washers with new ones and use thread locker when you bolt the discs (rotors) to the hubs.
I didn't replace the lock washers....so I did use loctite blue.
Regards
Peter
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Nice one Colin ! That is a great addition to the content.
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I didn't replace the lock washers....so I did use loctite blue.
FYI...You should always replace split lock washers as they will compress and lose some of their clamping ability. Plus the edges that bite into the mating surfaces dull and don't as good of a job. Also don't ever plate old split lock washers as they are a spring and can get hydrogen imbrittlement and will crack when installed.
They are cheap, available everywhere and are all standard. So really no reason not to. Just have the more common sizes on hand.
I have been really enjoying this thread BTW.
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Hi Wallace,
A correction for you
"They are cheap, available everywhere IN THE USA and are all standard."
You should try living in Portugal, only then will you realise just how good you have it when it comes to availability and cost of vehicle parts and services.
I certainly don't disagree with your recommendation though. You have inspired me to get on to Ebay and order a load up! I have plenty of plated "old" ones throughout my newly rebuilt subframe...doh !
Peter
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Hi Wallace,
A correction for you
"They are cheap, available everywhere IN THE USA and are all standard."
You should try living in Portugal, only then will you realise just how good you have it when it comes to availability and cost of vehicle parts and services.
I certainly don't disagree with your recommendation though. You have inspired me to get on to Ebay and order a load up! I have plenty of plated "old" ones throughout my newly rebuilt subframe...doh !
Peter
Amen. Try getting stuff in rural Italy. Everything is a 30 minute drive away and then you need to go to multiple stores to get what you need. I miss Canadian Tire, NAPA, Princess Auto and all the other good stores.
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Ok and corrected! Yeah but the trade off for living in rural Italy is the scenery. Dallas is an easy place to live, but not very interesting.
Unlike all of the other fasterenrs that Mercedes uses, split lock washers are all the same. So yes, the way to stock up is just buy all sizes at once.
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The washers used on those screws are not your standard washer at all. They're probably spring steel and more narrow in width.
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Terrific write up and right on time for me. I have the hubs off and new bearings in hand but one question: Is it necessary to remove the old races from the hubs and install the new ones that came with the new bearings? There is no indication that there was anything wrong with the old bearings. I'm just a little uncomfortable with knocking out the old races and getting the new ones in correctly since I've never done that before and I don't really have the right tools (like the brass block). Its not that I'm lazy, just a bit cautious.
Also, I see I don't have the contact springs but it looks like I can add that anytime. Do I need only on one side or both sides?
Thanks, Lee
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Hi Lee,
I believe I have seen some posts on here from "old hands" that suggest leaving in the old races if they are in good condition.
Regards
Peter
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You could be inventive and try copper pipe if you have some if that. Any soft metal should work.
I figured that I didn't have the experience to decide if the old ones were still good or not.
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Thanks everyone. I now have the bearing races out, hubs cleaned up and preparing for reassembly but waiting for a small scale from Amazon (about 12 bucks). One thing I did notice is that there was a fair amount of grease between the bearings inside the hub. The write up and the BBB specify in grams (hence the scale) the amount of grease to pack the bearings with as well as the amount to put in the cap but I could find no reference to an amount inside the hub between the bearings. It seems like if there was supposed to be grease in there, the amount would have also been specified in the BBB. For those who have done this job did you limit the grease to the bearings (45-55 grams (I assume per hub) and 20-25 grams for the outer cup).
Thanks in advance. Lee
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Hi Lee,
I just did this same job and filled with grease as you described.
Certainly there was a lot more of the old grease in my hubs as I found them than the measured quantity I put in.
I am interested to see what other answers you get back.
Regards
Peter
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I would suggest using verified weights to check your scale first. I used a digital kitchen scale to measure out 20g of MB grease and is almost filled the copper dustcap. On the images COL supplied, 25g barely filled the dustcap. BTW, the FEBI Repair kits contain endcaps that are too large for the early axles. The other parts in the kit are fine.
Before we get too paranoid about the exact quantity of grease, MB states that too much grease will raise the temperature and cause the grease to be be liquified. Speaking with the owner of a garage who over his 50 years of wrenching on cars has done plenty of wheel bearing repacking, he said to use your common sense and not a digital lab scale to measure out grease.