Pagoda SL Group

W113 Pagoda SL Group => Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes => Topic started by: Harry on February 26, 2020, 00:17:20

Title: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Harry on February 26, 2020, 00:17:20

Here is a bolt that I am unsure where it goes, but it has a ground, conical start.  It's not the shorter one that goes in to the timing chain just below the head but I remember it.  Just not sure where from?!

Ideas?

Harry

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: ja17 on February 26, 2020, 05:07:07

"All thread" bolts are somewhat rare on these engines. Maybe a non-original substitute? Possibly AC compressor mounting bolt?

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: stickandrudderman on February 26, 2020, 12:17:57

"All thread" is technically a screw not a bolt.
"Partial thread" is technically a bolt not a screw! (But I'm sure you knew that!)
Also, from my dim and distance past education, the difference between and "engine" and a "motor" is, IIRC, one is solid fuel powered and has no rotating parts (eg: a rocket) whereas the other is , well you get my drift and it was a long time ago.........
This particular screw is not something I recognise as belonging to a pagoda.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Harry on February 26, 2020, 12:49:04

A/C compressor mounting bolt - perhaps.  So the conical lead is simply to facilitate starting the bolt in the threads?  I have mounted the A/C compressor bracket already but I'll look there anyway.

Thanks,
Harry

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: MikeSimon on February 26, 2020, 13:00:14

So, Colin, a "steam engine" isn't really an engine, it is a motor?

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Pawel66 on February 26, 2020, 15:20:00

Quote from: stickandrudderman on February 26, 2020, 12:17:57

"All thread" is technically a screw not a bolt.
"Partial thread" is technically a bolt not a screw! (But I'm sure you knew that!)

One of the key mysteries of my life is solved.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: stickandrudderman on February 27, 2020, 12:45:58

From t'interweb:
"“Motor” is rooted in the Classical Latin movere, “to move.” It  first referred to propulsive force, and later, to the person or device  that moved something or caused movement. “As the word came through  French into English, it was used in the sense of ‘initiator, A person could be the motor of a plot or a political  organization.”

“Engine” is from the Latin ingenium: character, mental powers,  talent, intellect, or cleverness. In its journey through French and into  English, the word came to mean ingenuity, contrivance, and trick or  malice. “In the 15th century, it also referred to a physical device: an  instrument of torture, an apparatus for catching game, a net, trap, or  decoy,” .

Today, the words are virtually synonymous. “Language evolves to take on  new tasks, Without thinking about it, we adapt to new  meanings and leave the old behind.” We talk about our car’s  dashboard, unaware that in the 1840s, the word referred to the board at  the front of a carriage that stopped mud from being splashed on the  coachman."

Funny how we now abbreviate "dashboard" to "dash". Isn't language interesting!

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: MikeSimon on February 27, 2020, 13:08:30

We have the "different term" thread of the English language elsewhere and it is indeed interesting. Speaking two languages quite fluently and another two to get around as a tourist, I am always intrigued by words, their use and their origin. I also found that many people have their own preference of using a particular word as opposed to another one, depending on the environment they are in, whether that is a geographical area, work or hobby. Point in case: dash or dashboard. I never use it. I always use "instrument panel". 8)

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: stickandrudderman on February 27, 2020, 16:07:44

Instrument panels are found in aeroplanes!

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Tyler S on February 27, 2020, 17:31:02

dash·board
/ˈdaSHbôrd/
 
noun
1.
the panel facing the driver of a vehicle or the pilot of an aircraft, containing instruments and controls.
2.
HISTORICAL
a board of wood or leather in front of a carriage, to keep out mud.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: ja17 on February 28, 2020, 04:38:09

Stick, the Wiki describes a "screw" as a threaded fastener which creates its own threads, whereas a bolt uses pre-cut threads.  Now it also states that it is common for the manufacturers and end users to mix and deviate from these descriptions at least with our SAE standards. "All thread" is a term more often used to describe threaded rod in the USA. To be technically correct I guess I would have to describe the fastener as a "fully threaded bolt" (USA). In some ways the bolt pictured looks like it could be SAE and not metric? I would not be surprised if the DIN specifications and descriptions are more defined and precise as far as the differences of "screws and bolts"?

"I'm going to take the torch to the car since the light is out in the boot". (Americans might think your going to set the car on fire since the trunk light is not working!)

 Americans say "I'm going to take the flashlight to the car since the light in my trunk is not working"

Language and translation is not a perfect science and the above examples are both from English speaking countries.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Pawel66 on February 28, 2020, 07:04:57

Quote from: ja17 on February 28, 2020, 04:38:09

Stick, the Wiki describes a "screw" as a threaded fastener which creates its own threads, whereas a bolt uses pre-cut threads. 

That is what I thought it was!

But then native speakers here on the Forum did not use it this way and called fasteners using pre-cut threads "screws" as well....

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: stickandrudderman on February 28, 2020, 10:35:49

I like this discussion!
A "set screw" is a fully threaded bolt whereas a "self tapping screw" is a tapered screw designed to be inserted into a hole in thin sheet.
I once had a "Eureka" moment when an idea popped into my head for a self-taping screw that had it's own drill tip so you could drill and insert the screw in one action. I thought I would be set for life with this invention. It turned out they already existed and are called "Tek screws".  :-\

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: MikeSimon on February 28, 2020, 18:21:32

Aren't we Germans lucky! 8) Whether it is a bolt or a screw, we call it just "Schraube". That's,by the way,what all the threaded fasteners on the Pagodas are: "Schrauben"!
Zylinderkopfschrauben, Ölwannenschrauben, Kotflügelschrauben, Blechschrauben, Einstellschrauben and, I bet, even some Holzschrauben somewhere! ;)

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Cees Klumper on February 28, 2020, 19:27:05

I am sorry but did we ever figure out and agree the actual answer to the question?!
I thought about a bracket when I saw the 'thing' myself.
We do have a great capacity to veer off-topic!

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: MikeSimon on February 28, 2020, 21:03:01

Some dimensions would probably help to narrow it down: length, hex size and thread diameter?

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Benz Dr. on February 28, 2020, 22:25:07

Quote from: MikeSimon on February 28, 2020, 18:21:32

Aren't we Germans lucky! 8) Whether it is a bolt or a screw, we call it just "Schraube". That's,by the way,what all the threaded fasteners on the Pagodas are: "Schrauben"!
Zylinderkopfschrauben, Ölwannenschrauben, Kotflügelschrauben, Blechschrauben, Einstellschrauben and, I bet, even some Holzschrauben somewhere! ;)

Never to be confused with a holtzenconfloppen.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Shvegel on February 29, 2020, 00:07:02

All debate aside a picture of the head end would be helpful.  That way we can tell if it is metric or SAE thread.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: Harry on March 02, 2020, 17:09:39

Sure - I'll get that tonight.  I tend to recall that Joe was correct about the possibility of it being a bolt/screw for the A/C bracket.

And yes - WAY off topic! :)

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: John Betsch - "SADIE" on March 02, 2020, 19:07:04

Thought I would add to this interesting language discussion  Below (sorry abut the caps) are some words on a sign when my car is shown  It is interesting the reactions I get:

ALLES TOURISTEN AND NON-TECHNISCHEN LOKKENS PEEPERS

DAS 1965 ROT. MET. MACHINE IS NICHT FUR FINGERPOKEN UND
MITTENGRABBEN.

ODERWISE, IS EASY SCHAPPEN DER SPROGGENWERK,
BLOWNFUSE, UND POPPERCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKEN.

DER MACHINE IS DIGGEN BY EXPERTEN ONLY.
IS NICHT FUR GERVERKEN BY DAS DUMKOPFEN.

RUBBERNEKEN, SIGHTSEENEN, IS PERMITTEN, BUT KEEPEN DAS
COTTENPICKEN HANDS IN DAS POCKETS


SO RELAXEN UND WATCHEN DAS VUNDERBAR MACHINE.

[/center][/center]

JB

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: MikeSimon on March 02, 2020, 19:08:08

You can take the bolt/screw to almost any hardware store and check the threads on a "thread checker' board to determine category and size.

Title: Re: Another "Identify" Please
Post by: ejboyd5 on March 02, 2020, 20:11:49

A "motor" is powered by electricity, which has already been converted to a source of energy by an engine using a raw fuel.  An "engine" is a device that makes energy from a raw fuel through a process of heat or combustion or from a raw fuel such as wind or water that has been harnessed to provide a rotational force to something such as a turbine.