Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => General Discussion => Topic started by: rjmarco on March 06, 2018, 21:21:05
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I am seeking some advice concerning the right baffle plate in my 230 SL. I recently had the engine pulled and now have access to the baffle plate shown in the attachment. My baffle plate has a large section that was cut out sometime in the car's history. My guess is that this was done to help install the air conditioning hardware. Does anyone know whether this was a required modification when A/C units were installed in US models?
If not, I am considering having my baffle plate repaired with a spare that I bought out of a salvage yard.
Any comments will be appreciated.
Regards,
Rich
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First of all I would never put AC in a 230SL. Install your new part without any mods.
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Thanks for the prompt reply. To clarify my situation, the A/C was already installed sometime in the car's history and I had it restored to working order. I must say that I hardly use it living in Northern California and when I do, it's a real drag on the car's performance.
With the engine now out for overhaul, I'm considering replacing the gouged baffle plate and hoping that I can get everything to fit back together without needing a baffle plate modification unless absolutely necessary. Attached is a photo of the modified baffle plate which is pretty ugly. I can't imagine that this would have been what was required to install the A/C originally.
Any other thoughts would be appreciated.
Regards,
Rich
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Rich,
The A/C units were all dealer installed options.
In your case, I guess the installer didn't read the instructions in installing the system.
The baffle in your picture should surround the air intake filter cylinder.
Guess now you are not able to fasten the air filter.
It should be removed and a new one installed.
Easier now with the engine out of the way.
Hope you're not deterred.
Walter
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First of all I would never put AC in a 230SL. Install your new part without any mods.
Dan, why wouldn't you? I know two 230sl owners that have it and are happy with it. Are you talking about the original (dealer installed) ac units or any?
The reason why I am asking, and before I am going ahead, is that I am planning to install a new Buds Benz unit it as well. What is your or anybody's concern?
Appreciated.
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The original York AC pump had tendency to vibrate a lot. 230SL cranks aren't as strong as 250 or 280 units and I've seen a couple of them crack and then snap off just before the front crank seal.
Our cars were never meant to have AC installed and just because you can doesn't mean you should. Not engine or mechanic friendly.
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That "baffle plate" if that's the name, looks like a really bad modification to accommodate a high mount Sanden compressor with a sedan AC bracket and Sanden compressor adapter. It's awful!
I modified mine for the above system, but it's not that bad. If I could find one of those baffles, I would buy it to accommodate Jim Viller's modification "LAW" in case the next owner wants to make it "original".
Tom Kizer
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Hi, Tom and Walter.
Thanks for the comments. Have also seen a reference to this part as a "casing plate".
Will definitely not be deterred with this unique opportunity to make this part correct or much closer to correct. After the engine goes back in, I'll work with my mechanic to check for any new interference with the A/C and alternator.
I wonder if anyone has a photo of a 230 SL engine bay with the A/C installed but with the baffle plate unmodified.
Appreciate the advice!
Rich
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I am not sure if you fully understood Tominstuff's comment. The Frigiking bracket for the AC on our cars is a massive affair that wraps around most of the front of the engine and mounts the compresssor low in the position of the alternator on a non AC car. The sedans of the era have a different much smaller bracket that mounts the compressor up high above the alternator which remains in the factory position. The Sedan bracket is much preferred if you ever have to do any maintenance on the front of the engine. However, the combination of the sedan bracket along with the Adaptor plate that allows you to mount the Sanden compressor put the whole affair out so far from the engine that it may run into the baffle plate. A trick I learned from Joe Alexander is to cut the "ears" off of the Sanden adaptor bracket and weld the directly to the sedan bracket to gain more space. This is the installation manual for the AC in our cars. You might want to verify that you have the correct bracket for your compressor.
https://www.sl113.org/wiki/uploads/Cooling/Air%20Conditioning%20Installation%20Instructions%20for%20Mercedes%20Benz%20280SL.pdf
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Thank you. This is most helpful.
From a quick look at this, I can't see any reference to cutting or modifying what they refer to as the air cleaner housing shroud in photo 21. They only refer to the need to drill two small holes for hose attachment mounting screws. This gives me a more confidence that I should repair/restore the shroud as new and check for interference with the existing A/C hardware.
Regards,
Rich
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The original York AC pump had tendency to vibrate a lot. 230SL cranks aren't as strong as 250 or 280 units and I've seen a couple of them crack and then snap off just before the front crank seal.
Our cars were never meant to have AC installed and just because to can doesn't mean you should. Not engine or mechanic friendly.
Thank you Dan. Not what I wanted to hear but certainly something to consider.
Rich, sorry for hijacking your post a little bit.
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Glad that you did! I learned from more this discussion as well.
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Thought that I would keep everyone updated on this post. I had the replacement baffle plate that I bought from a salvage yard installed while I had the engine out for overhaul. Next step is to put the engine back in and check for any interference. Hopefully, there will be none but fingers crossed.
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Rich,
From the looks, you got everything right.
Even down to the brush painted black strip for the radiator mounting.
Great job there!
Walter
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Thank you! I am fortunate to have a great euro mechanic and body man to help me.
Rich
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Looking great Rich,
Well done.
Chris
Cape Town
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Many thanks!
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I thought that I'd keep all interested up to date on this project of mine to restore the baffle plate (for the air filter canister) and reinstall a rebuilt engine including the Mercedes-Benz air conditioning system.
My replacement baffle plate is newly installed and the rebuilt engine has been dropped back into place including the A/C compressor. While trying to fit up the alternator, it does appear that there is some clash with the baffle plate. This may required a small modification to the baffle plate which I am naturally reluctant to do.
Researching our forum I have found quite a bit on information from past postings that makes reference to modified baffle plates. A lot of this is pretty ugly as you'll see from the photos included. This all related to how A/C units were installed by dealers or others back in the day.
I have seen other photos of installed A/C systems where the alternator has sufficient clearance from the baffle plate. My mechanic and I are now trying to understand why we have interference - whether it's a bracket or alternator issue.
Any thoughts would be appreciated.
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Might the original "modification" been caused by a flying fan blade? Just sayin'.
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The baffle plate on a 230SL is different than those used on 250 and 280SL's. The width of the opening to fit the rad is quite a bit narrower on a 230 and that's why things will start to hit the baffle plate. Aside from the weaker crankshaft, this is one more reason why I try to steer owners away from AC in 230SL's.
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Thanks for these comments. This is very helpful. I must say that where I've seen pictures where there isn't any interference, it's been on 250 and 280SLs. For a 230SL, I guess "it is what it is".
I live in Northern California. I originally restored the A/C to working order but I have rarely used it with the mild climate and I really only do so to exercise it mechanically. When it runs, it's a noticeable drag on the engine.
So, with a newly rebuilt engine, I'm now thinking wondering whether I just pull the A/C out or leave it installed bu make a simpler baffle plate modification.
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A fresh engine will help out a lot. I guess this is the time to decide before you install anything. I know what I would do. ;D
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I take it that you'd pull the A/C out. Correct? This would mean pulling the existing bracket meant for the A/C compressor and alternator set-up and replacing it with the original bracket (if it could be acquired) to put the alternate back in its original lower position. Any comments on this?
By the way, I checked out the SLS website to look at baffle plates. There are indeed two different ones as you noted earlier. There is one for 230SL and then another for 250/280Sls.
I really appreciate your thoughts. Thanks for taking the time.
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The bracket for mounting the alternator shouldn't be too difficult to find. There are two types; the early metal strap unit and the later cast iron type. The late one is easier for installing the alternator and requires a lot fewer parts which are expensive.
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Great. Thanks for the advice. Much appreciated.
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Update: My mechanic also thought that I'd be better off without the A/C given this is an opportune time with the rebuilt engine being put back in the car. I was able to order a new alternator bracket so as to put it back in its original position. I ordered it from the Classic Center and it will be sourced from Germany. I am very comfortable with this decision given my desire to have great engine performance and little planned use for the A/C. Lastly, there is now also no need to cut into my new baffle plate!!
Thanks again for the advice and encouragement. Rich
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YEAH!!!! :) :) :)
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YEAH!!!! :) :) :)
:) :) Now your legacy is preserved as there are followers. :) :)
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Yep. Another convert to no Air Conditioner, pulled mine out years ago. If its hot, (35c) put the roof down, if its really hot, 40c+ don't drive. Pretty simple.
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Or ... if its hot put the roof down, if it's really hot drive faster! ;^)