Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => General Discussion => Topic started by: Douglas on October 11, 2004, 22:47:48
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Here's one on ebay with a chin spoiler. Never seen one on a Pagoda before:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2493891534&category=6315
(Obviously, it's not factory. Just thought it was interesting to see one.)
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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Looks ok, sort of though I would like to see it in the "flesh" as it were. Doubt if it would have much aerodynamic effect though Pagoda's do have the aerodynamics of a housebrick compared to more modern stuff.
However that said aerodynamic aids do make a difference, a BMW3.0CSL with a "batmobile" rear wing, roof spoiler, front spoiler and front wing splitters handles, but we are talking at over 100mph :)
Malc
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Mmmm you must have sharp eyes.......I can hardly see !
Still its one aspect of the car that I dont like, probably the only one, the fact that you can see some of the bits hanging down at the front !
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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May help cooling, OEM's often added air dams, to aid cooling.
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This car does not have the chrome strips behind the rear wheels. I have seen others like this. Would these have been removed during repaint?
Bruce; 268Blaugrun(green) 1970 280SL; IL
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I knew there was something odd about it !
Also I think the aerial is in the wrong place, the tail pipes are incorrect and there are no badges on the trunk lid !
Not that my car is perfect, its far from it !
Seller also describes it as SILVER !!
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Very intresting looking chin spoiler, almost excapes your eye as does the missing horn ring. I wonder if this came off a R-107 560SL. their where also quite a few intresting modifications like locking storage boxes built into the box sections behind the seats. I did notice the position of the radio antenna and can vouch that on European models some SL did get the antenna mounted there. The paint looks to be DB 180 silver .
Gee the more I look at it the more wacky things I catch.
Bob Geco
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It may have been a cool look at one time when an owner tried to set their car apart from others. As for aerodynamic value I don't think it would be of much use. If anything it could be used to indicate when a driveway is too steep. :)
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Here's something strange to add to Doug's discussion.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 230 bumber.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/20041012224231_230%20bumber.jpg)
41.57 KB
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Hauser,
That's to protect that expensive grille. Looks like one might hit a cow driving where that car is parked!
I would assume the chin spoiler is to push air up to the radiator to cool the engine, not for aerodynamics. I would like to see that in person and I would like to test it's functionality. If it doesn't look too bad, and could be painted to match the body, then it might be a good modern modification!
Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both tops
1994 E420
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Hello, I am the owner of the 280SL that is listed. I got an Email from your user Hauser. He asked me if I could answer some questions. First the chin spoiler; the chin spoiler was fabricated to hide the void between the two front fenders. It was custom made from abs plastic. No it is not low enough to scrape, and has limited aerodynamic down force. I thought about painting it … but I didn’t want to call attention to it. Second; the steering wheel is original, but I bought a spare and leathered the winglets (Personal preference). I have however kept all original parts to revert to stock. The antenna is in its original hole. My data plate shows automatic antenna. During the restoration the car was stripped to bare metal and no evidence of a front fender hole exists, I looked because I was confused. Third; the rear deck badge holes were professionally weld-filled with aluminum (personal preference) but the stock badges are again included. Fourth; the lock boxes were made from W111 glove box hardware to provide easer access and hide a stereo that is housed in the lid.
Some “personal preferences” that were not discussed…No paint on coolant reservoir, 230SL Rearview mirror, Aluminum tank cap of unknown origin, Electronic ignition, 69 dealer option wheels on a 68, custom aluminum front plate bracket to hide euro mounting holes, Radio delete plate on a car w/ antenna
I have extensive knowledge on these cars and have reviewed you site before, but forgive me for saying this but I belong to another forum… rennlist… and can only devote time to one. If you have any more questions or might want to know about some worthy restoration modifications... I will be happy to answer what I can. Please leave the technical mechanics to your wealth of experts on this forum… because anyone who restores a car knows he is not the expert, but the beneficiary of the wealth of his predecessor’s knowledge.
Charles
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quote:
Originally posted by rwmastel
Hauser,
That's to protect that expensive grille. Looks like one might hit a cow driving where that car is parked!
I would assume the chin spoiler is to push air up to the radiator to cool the engine, not for aerodynamics. I would like to see that in person and I would like to test it's functionality. If it doesn't look too bad, and could be painted to match the body, then it might be a good modern modification!
Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both tops
1994 E420
No cows in Saint Louis
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quote:
Originally posted by Bruere
No cows in Saint Louis
Bruere,
Hi. I was referring to this picture:
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 230 bumber.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/20041012224231_230%20bumber.jpg)
41.57 KB
Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both tops
1994 E420
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I have seen chrome guards as shown in the picture posted on other Pagoda's-designed to protect the very expensive grill. Seems odd to spend money on protective chrome bars that take away from the look of the grill/car. Kind of like keeping plastic on your sofa for 20 years so the fabric does not get messed up!
I like the looks of the black scoop on the Ebay car, and providing access to the void under the parcel shelf area for storage is a good add. Too bad Mercedes did not introduce both features while the car was in production. Perhaps the future retro version of the Pagoda will fix these oversights (hope springs eternal). In my humble opinion, tasteful modifications like this add to the texture of our Pagoda community.
Best,
Tom
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
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I like the looks of the black scoop on the Ebay car, and providing access to the void under the parcel shelf area for storage is a good add. Too bad Mercedes did not introduce both features while the car was in production. Perhaps the future retro version of the Pagoda will fix these oversights (hope springs eternal). In my humble opinion, tasteful modifications like this add to the texture of our Pagoda community.
Best,
Tom
[/quote]
Thank you for you comments. I try to
1. Modify in a way that improves on a design.
2. Can be reversed to stock.
3. Serves to reflect the owner’s tastes without distracting from the designers intent.
The car is silver DB 180; the paint was a special order with finer metallic. I have gone way overboard on this car… over 15K in the paint job alone. I defiantly won’t do this again.
To address the exhaust; he system is an exact duplicate of the original except in stainless steel by borla. I have new chrome tips; just don’t like them on the car.
Charles
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Charles,
Can you provide additional commentary on the paint? I like the sheen and wonder if using a more fine metallic flake in the paint produces the sheen.
Also, the finish on the wheels looks very nice-any special paint used?
Best,
Tom
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom
Charles,
Can you provide additional commentary on the paint? I like the sheen and wonder if using a more fine metallic flake in the paint produces the sheen.
Also, the finish on the wheels looks very nice-any special paint used?
Best,
The finer metallic prevents the flatness that DB 180 tends to get. The paint has a better shade shift and produces a deeper color. Direct sun is defiantly silver with no blues. Shade/overcast will tend towards a putty. The other art is the tried and true…Paint/sand/paint/sand etc… the clear, removing all orange peal. The car has the wet look all the time.
The wheels are painted with Wurth abrasion resistant lacquer wheel-rim spray; Color is Metallic Silver. And clear coated with the same in the clear
Another interesting modification is the soft top drain holes. The holes under the soft top rubber gasket have had brass fittings brazed onto the holes. Neoprene tubes joined with the soft top tray drains were routed out the bottom of the car. This keeps the water out of the inside of the automobile.
Charles
Tom
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
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Sorry Tom, it appears that I inserted my comments into you message.
Charles
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A beneficial modification for 280SL seats.
When I restored my seats I took the precaution of updating the bases to prevent the chance of breakage or sagging. The 1996 E class seats have a bolster pad to prevent sagging (I noticed the part in a seat cutaway at the car show). The part is very robust and fits perfectly in the 280SL seats. I welded a cross brace and the seat is at the same level of firmness but now the bolsters never sag.
Charles
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quote:
Another interesting modification is the soft top drain holes. The holes under the soft top rubber gasket have had brass fittings brazed onto the holes. Neoprene tubes joined with the soft top tray drains were routed out the bottom of the car. This keeps the water out of the inside of the automobile
.........now that IS clever ! Are these neoprene tubes exiting through the larger grommets for the main flat area and are there tubes from there down to the sill exit holes ?
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben
quote:
Another interesting modification is the soft top drain holes. The holes under the soft top rubber gasket have had brass fittings brazed onto the holes. Neoprene tubes joined with the soft top tray drains were routed out the bottom of the car. This keeps the water out of the inside of the automobile
.........now that IS clever ! Are these neoprene tubes exiting through the larger grommets for the main flat area and are there tubes from there down to the sill exit holes ?
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
The exit holes in the rear finder in front of the wheel well were closed to prevent the elements from intruding from below. The neoprene tubes exit from the caps in the rear well boxes, and have been venturi”ed” to create a negative atmosphere that draws the water out.
Charles
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<<<The exit holes in the rear finder in front of the wheel well were closed to prevent the elements from intruding from below. The neoprene tubes exit from the caps in the rear well boxes, and have been venturi”ed” to create a negative atmosphere that draws the water out>>
Charles
So, They pitch back ?? or straight down to travel ?
Tnx
A Dalton
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So, They pitch back ?? or straight down to travel ?
Tnx
A Dalton
[/quote]
The point down w/ slight pitch venture is cut in the back.
I can produce pictures but I don’t think that I can post on this forum.
Charles
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quote:
Originally posted by Bruere
So, They pitch back ?? or straight down to travel ?
Tnx
A Dalton
The point down w/ slight pitch venturi is cut in the back.
I can produce pictures but I don’t think that I can post on this forum.
Charles
[/quote]
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Charles,
You could email me a jpg, if that is cool w/you..
Tnx
AJDalton7@aol.com
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quote:
Originally posted by A Dalton
Charles,
You could email me a jpg, if that is cool w/you..
Tnx
AJDalton7@aol.com
OK, sent you pictures
Charles
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quote:
Originally posted by Bruere
quote:
Originally posted by A Dalton
Charles,
You could email me a jpg, if that is cool w/you..
Tnx
AJDalton7@aol.com
OK, sent you pictures
Charles
C,
Got them....
Very Good
Danke
A Dalton
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Charles, it seems like this site is growing on you. Are you sure you still want to sell your car?
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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quote:
Originally posted by hauser
Charles, it seems like this site is growing on you. Are you sure you still want to sell your car?
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
Never wanted to sell it. Just have too many garage queens. As you are well aware the worst thing you can do to these cars is not drive them. I don’t have the time anymore to exercise this car. The decision had to be made to drive it or sell it. I just couldn’t bring myself to relegate it to the daily driver that I once intended.
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Arthur,
Can you post the pictures you received from Charles?
Best,
Tom
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
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quote:
Originally posted by Tom
Arthur,
Can you post the pictures you received from Charles?
Best,
Tom
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
He send a zip and I can not get it on ..
I can send it to you ..or maybe someone can tell me how to get it on without a url
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Arthur,
Pls send it to me at classic280sl@yahoo.com and I will unzip and post.
Thanks
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
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Done...
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Here are photos:
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) Rear deck drain-small.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Tom/20041019235925_Rear%20deck%20drain-small.JPG)
56.21 KB
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) Under car venturi-small.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Tom/200410200134_Under%20car%20venturi-small.JPG)
34.56 KB
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) Soft Top compartment drain-small.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Tom/20041020039_Soft%20Top%20compartment%20drain-small.JPG)
13.86 KB
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) Tube2-small.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Tom/200410200613_Tube2-small.JPG)
33.71 KB
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
1970 280sl Deep Red (Project Car)
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This is very interesting to me as I live in a Country where it rains a lot, sometimes quite heavy, and water can build up and /or collect in areas you really dont want.
I had wtare getting under the seats and eventually traced it to the soft top box. I ended up sealing various areas and making tubes that go from the larger flat grommets to the sill drain holes.
Now in the 3rd photo,what exactly are we looking at, I mean I know what part of the car that is but I dont see the modification here ? Is there a larger picture available ?
Also and again on this photo there is a ridge running from just outside the area where the silver bracket bolts down, runing fore and aft, presumably to prevent any water moving accross further into the soft top box, does eveyone have this ridge ?
Also there appears to be a hole towards the front of this section, is this the mod ??
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben
This is very interesting to me as I live in a Country where it rains a lot, sometimes quite heavy, and water can build up and /or collect in areas you really dont want.
I had wtare getting under the seats and eventually traced it to the soft top box. I ended up sealing various areas and making tubes that go from the larger flat grommets to the sill drain holes.
Now in the 3rd photo,what exactly are we looking at, I mean I know what part of the car that is but I dont see the modification here ? Is there a larger picture available ?
Also and again on this photo there is a ridge running from just outside the area where the silver bracket bolts down, runing fore and aft, presumably to prevent any water moving accross further into the soft top box, does eveyone have this ridge ?
Also there appears to be a hole towards the front of this section, is this the mod ??
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
The third photo is just a reference photo of the stock drain hole that is located in the far front corner (not the rubber plug grommet). There is no modification here just a note to the other drain hole. This hole has an existing metal tube attached, and I just attached a neoprene tube to it. The tube leads down to a Y attachment that connects to the soft top rubber gasket drain hole mod.
The ridge should be stock.
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quote:
The third photo is just a reference photo of the stock drain hole that is located in the far front corner (not the rubber plug grommet). There is no modification here just a note to the other drain hole. This hole has an existing metal tube attached, and I just attached a neoprene tube to it. The tube leads down to a Y attachment that connects to the soft top rubber gasket drain hole mod.
The ridge should be stock
.........thanks I appreciate the info and clarification !
Thing is my car does not have ANY hole in that forward corner ! I DO have the ridge but it doesn't look as well defined as the one in this picture !
Anybody else have the hole ??
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Thing is my car does not have ANY hole in that forward corner ! I DO have the ridge but it doesn't look as well defined as the one in this picture !
Anybody else have the hole ??
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
[/quote]
If you want I can take a close up of the hole and email it to you.
The hole seems to be stock. On the back side of the hole there is a metal tube that extends down from the hole. I can’t believe that some one added this feature.
Charles
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If you can do that Charles that would be really helpful !
Where did you say the tube exits ??
You can mail to bencosgrave@torion.iol.ie.
Thanks again..........aprreciate it !
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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quote:
Originally posted by Ben
If you can do that Charles that would be really helpful !
Where did you say the tube exits ??
You can mail to bencosgrave@torion.iol.ie.
Thanks again..........aprreciate it !
Undeliverable Email address
Heres mine;
Charles@Bruere.org
Charles
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Sorry Charles...........I cant even spell my own email address........what chance do I have of fixing water leaks ! ;)
It should've been bencosgrave@torsion.iol.ie
I appreciate the info.........I had a terrible weekend with my car. I drove home on Friday in very heavy rain, we were going away for the weekend and I left the headlights on.........for 4 days !!
It rained all weekend, my car would normally be indoors but I was late and didn't really want to put away a wet car. I though the weather would improve but it got worse and the car leaked !! The rear carpet is soaked and I eed a new battery !!
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Thanks for the photo Charles !
I'm getting nearer now .......however I think I will need to start a fresh thread for extra input.....see "Soft Top Drainage" !
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor