Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Drive train, fuel, suspension, steering & brakes => Topic started by: bpossel on August 26, 2004, 06:17:24
-
All,
When I bought my 280sl a few months ago, it came with Michelin P195/75 R14 Rainforce MX4's (Whitewalls). Yesterday I ran over something that cut the tire (not repairable).
Looks like I will need 4 new ones, whereas Michelin no longer makes the Rainforce MX4 and no longer makes whitewalls.
What tires do you have on your 113? What size? I read that the original size was 185/80 R14.
Bob
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
-
66 230SL 205/70/14. Check the speed rating on the tire you buy to make sure it is applicable to your car.
-
For what it's worth, I just ordered a set of the current tires Michelin offers in 185/80 R14 from tirerack.com. (Michelin is also offering a rebate right now if you order 4 tires.)
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
My 69 has the 205/70/14s that were on the steel rims and now are on the alloys with no fender rubbing. Costco has the all of the sizes in Michelin and other brands.
-
Hey Doug, how much are 4 correct-sized Michelins at Tirerack?
BTW I just tried the Tirerack.com site and it came back with no tires available at that size (185/80-14).
Cees Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic
-
I have the rainforce WW on my car and am pleased with them. I knew Michelin no longer made these tires and one day I would have to find a suitable substitute.
If you are looking for original size you can do as Doug did and go to www.tirerack.com You'll have some choices here. Look for the "shop for tires." Type in the criteria 195/75/14 or if you want the size Doug has 185/ 0 / 14 if you type in 80 you will not get any results, leave the aspect ratio blank (0). The Michelin in your size WW is available only that it is in a narrower strip than your Rainforce tire. The Tire Rack people are very knowledgeable 1-888-541-1777 they should be able to answer most of your questions.
One more option to consider if you want a 3/4" WW original size tires go to www.coker.com $167 each![:0]
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
-
Cees,
Michelin Agilis: $104 each, before rebate.
To use their search engine, don't type in the profile.
BTW, I had Michelin Rainforce tires on my previous SL and thought they were terrific. I think the closest thing they have to Rainforce is their "Harmony" series, but it's not available in 185/80-14.
BTW, I believe the original 185 R14 is not really an 80-series. I believe 80 is a very close approximation.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
quote:
Originally posted by bpossel
What tires do you have on your 113? What size? I read that the original size was 185/80 R14.
Bob
Hi Bob,
I have Michelin MXV-P 185HR14 (which is the original size and speed rating -up to 210 km/h- for all W113) in my 230 SL. Michelin has this tire in its Classic Line range. I think MXV-P, and the "Phoenix" from Coker (I was told that Phoenix has less quality and grip than the Michelin), are the only two tires you can find nowadays in the original size and speed rating (fresh new tires, of course)...
This MXV-P tire is listed here: http://www.michelin-passion.com/passion/front/templates/affich.jsp?codeRubrique=40&lang=EN&dimension=1
For the USA, Coker is the importer of the Michelin Classic Line:
COKER Tire
1317 Chestnut Street. Chattanooga, TN 37402 (USA)
Tel : (423) 265-6368 Fax : (423) 756-5607
www.coker.com
e-mail : corkyc@coker.com
Contact : Corky Coker
Regards
Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
-
Albert, I tried to find a picture of this MXV-P tire but was unable to. Can you help with this?
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
-
Unless you're doing the car show circuit, don't buy the Phoenix tires. A very reliable source (Tom Sargeant) says they drive terribly. It's purely for the "look."
To say that tire technology has significantly evolved since the 60s is probably the biggest understatement ever made in this forum.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
I am really down on Coker Tire. The sold me the tires as an authentic reproduction, but the tire did not have the rub stripe. I learn later that the early run of the tires they offered as authentic did not have the rub stripe. So how authentic could they be???? This is THE distinguishing visual element of the early tires.
I asked them to take the tires back-no response to my email.
I rarely make negative comments regarding vendors in public forums, but for $167 per tire, one would expect to get at least what was advertised. So to recap:
1. Not what was advertised-missing the rub stripe;
2. Non repsonsive to my emails
3. Terrible ride
4. Terribly expensive
Other than these points, the tires were fine.
_____________________________________________
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
_____________________________________________
-
195/70/R14 Michelin X-Ones. Blackwalls. Nice tires.
James
63 230SL
-
Tom, sorry to hear about this. If you had to do it all over again what would you buy today?
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
-
Does any one know what the overall diameter of the original tires?
Has anyone tried the Bridgestone Turanza LS-T? The tread pattern looks similar to that of the Michelin Rainforce.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
-
Tom, I too, bought the "original" tires from Coker and got the same product you described. I was really disappointed in the appearance, as I wanted the rub rib like my spare (I still have the original Firestone spare!). I notified Coker that their product was not as described and that it even looked like they pulled my order from the dust bin. The description of the tire on the website also measured the whitewall width wrong. It said it was wider than it actually measured. Maybe they corrected the website description, I have not looked to see if it was corrected. That should be grounds for a return authorization if it still exists.
Coker responded properly and refunded my purchase including freight for one direction. I hope they respond for you in a like manner.
As for tires, I eventually purchased Pirelli P400 from the Tire Rack. I ordered them on a Friday and received them on Monday. Great service, and a great touring tire. The whitewall stripe is a nice width.
-
I put the Bridgestone Turanza LS-H (195-70-14) on my car a few months ago. They are only blackwall, but the handling improved greatly, I am very happy with them. Got them from Tire Rack.
1967 230sl (stick)
-
I bought the Turanza LS-T earlier this year and I am very pleased with this tire. I wanted a quiet ride, whitewalls, no bizarre sidewall markings and no agressive tread. These tires in a 195/75-14 fit the bill for me, they look right, ride great and made a huge difference from the ten year old Michelins that I had. The reviews on Tirerack and others were fairly consistent in rating the Michelins as a noisier tire and I don't know if the Pirelli 400 is still available in a WW but I did like it's appearance.
Chris
-
Houser,
I would not buy again. I have seen the newer version and the rub stripe on the "newer" production run is situated too close to the center of the tire compared to the original tire. I also wonder how true the dimensions are to the original tire. I just think they are over selling how authentic the tire is. They are also selling a tire that rides poorly, lacks authenticity and they sell the tire at an outrageously high price.
Best,
Tom
_____________________________________________
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
_____________________________________________
-
I looked around a lot at tires for something that has a reasonable look (not too modern looking) while at the same time offered a smooth ride and reasonable performance. I settled on the Goodyear Assurance 195-70-14. There are two tread patterns and I got the one that has more of a retro look to it. They are very nice tires and I have no copmplaints. I came close to buying the Firestone Phoenix from Coker but, based on what I read below, I'm glad I didn't.
Mike
Michael L. Hund
-
Hi All,
This is such a great group of friends! Thank you for all of your replys!!!! The MX4's have been a good tire, and I have 3 with less than 10k miles if anyone is interested in them...
Anyway, based on your replys and since I drive the car on a regular basis, I have decided to buy the Bridgestone Turanza LS-T. It seems that not only some of our fellow 113 drivers have and like them, but they are also very well rated by Consumer Reports.
Again, Thank you all for your support!!!
Bob
ps. tomorrow I have taken the day off from work to install a new timing chain, sprocket and tensioner. I'll update you on how it went via another post...
quote:
Originally posted by bpossel
All,
When I bought my 280sl a few months ago, it came with Michelin P195/75 R14 Rainforce MX4's (Whitewalls). Yesterday I ran over something that cut the tire (not repairable).
Looks like I will need 4 new ones, whereas Michelin no longer makes the Rainforce MX4 and no longer makes whitewalls.
What tires do you have on your 113? What size? I read that the original size was 185/80 R14.
Bob
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
-
quote:
Originally posted by hauser
Albert, I tried to find a picture of this MXV-P tire but was unable to. Can you help with this?
Hi,
attached is an ad from the MB Classic Center, about the Michelin MXV-P tires and the Pagoda. MB shows this MXV-P 185HR14 as the correct tire for the W113. The "P" from "MXV-P" means that it has the rub stripe that Tom misses in his Phoenix...
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) MXV-P.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Albert-230SL/20048272391_MXV-P.jpg)
80.04 KB
and here another view of the MXV-P pattern:
(http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Albert-230SL/2004827448_MXV-P.gif)
Regards
Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
-
Good afternoon gentlemen, I am Jim Hildebrand with Coker Tire. I got blasted here yesterday, and thought I ought to respond specifically to Tom.
Dear Tom
I read your email this morning, and I visited the chat room. Following your example, it seems proper to respond to you in public. I apologize for my slow response to your August 13th email, but on, and since, that specific date, I have been dealing with personal and family issues ( I lost 2 family members within 12 hours of each other) that have kept me out of the office. I did see your email, and thought it unreasonable considering that you purchased the tires on June 6th of 2002, and determined to respond to you at a later date when I could give you my full attention. By the way, we do have a toll free number and full staff of customer service representatives that would have been happy to talk to you. I appreciate your concern about "the view of Coker Tire being tarnished" I wish you would have called. Now that I am back in the office, I'll respond to your request.
No, I don't think it is reasonable to exchange 2 year old tires simply because our newer tires have a curb guard and our older tires do not. We added the curb guard after the tire had been initially introduced as a response to the preferences of our customers.
Regarding other comments posted on this public forum, we developed the 185R14 Phoenix because there was not a tire available with the original 185R14 size markings. The 185R14 Phoenix is manufactured for a very limited group of collector cars, and therefore is built in production runs of only 250 units, hence the high production cost. Regarding the quality, these tires are built in a Michelin approved factory. It meets all U.S. and European standards for Highway use. Specific to the position of the curb guard, we were able to modify the tire mold to form the curb guard, but we are limited by the mold itself as to where that specific feature can be located.
There are other high production modern sized (195/70R14) radial tires available. Our objective is to provide a tire with the correct size nomenclature and an authentic style tread and side wall, I don’t think you will find anyone else making such an effort. I do appreciate those of you who have our product on your car, and who appreciate our efforts to supply authentic tires to the collector car hobbyist. Our policy still stands that if you purchase tires from Coker Tire and upon receipt of those tires determine that you can not use them. You are welcome to send them back for a refund. If you would like to speak with me or any of our customer service representatives, we provide a toll free number 1-800-251-6336. Just call us and speak directly.
Thank you for reading my comments.
Sincerely,
Jim Hildebrand
Vice President, Export Sales
Coker Tire
-----Original Message-----
From: <Tom Sargeant> classic280sl@yahoo.com [mailto:classic280sl@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2004 8:07 PM
To: jimh@coker.com
Cc: corkyc@coker.com
Subject: Fw: 185R14
Jim,
I never received a reply to my email. I generally don't say negative
things about vendors on public forums. However, my disappointment over
these tires combined with a lack of response to my email moved me to
respond negatively when asked about the tires.
You can see my posts at the following link. This is an active vintage
board and the view of the Coker tire is getting tarnished.
Jim,
I must have purchased that first production run as I was disappointed when
my set arrived without the rub stripe. I have been spreading some
mis-information to potential buyers, as I have told people not to bother
with the tire as it did not have the rub stripe that the original Phoenix
had.
Wondering if Coker would take my original tires back and provide me with
the tires with the rub stripe. I paid $160 per tire so they were premium
priced at the time. It would be a nice gesture that I could share with the
rest of the vintage Mercedes community.
Thanks for your consideration.
Best,
Tom
-
Jim,
Your company has a fine reputation and you carry many products that can't be found anywhere else.
Nonetheless, I have to pose this question: If your goal is to produce "authentic style sidewalls," shouldn't you be willing to make a concession to a customer who was supplied with something that was less than authentic?
In terms of authenticity, your product as sold to Tom is defective. The fact that you made the change to subsequent Phoenix tires concedes that.
(If I sound surprised at this transaction, it's because I've always presumed Coker to be an excellent company.)
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Hildebrand
... we developed the 185R14 Phoenix because there was not a tire available with the original 185R14 size markings.
Hi Jim,
I'm very sorry for your personal issues.
Just to confirm the information I have: Michelin nowadays produces again (in the Classic Line) its MXV-P in the original W113 size (185R14), speed rating (H = up to 210 km/h), and curb guard. The Spanish importer of the Michelin Classic Line (Pneum Galacta) sent me a list of the importers of that Classic Line all over the world, and Coker Tire was listed as the importer for the USA. Is this correct? Do you have this MXV-P 185HR14?
Best regards
Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
-
Albert, is this Michelin MXV-P available in a WW?
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
-
Douglas,
Thank you for you comments about our company.
Although we were able to use the name "Pheonix", the 185R14 Phoenix is not a reproduction or replica of the Firestone tire. In fact, the majority of our sales are going into Europe where the Firestone was not the O.E. tire. Nevertheless, if the original Fireston mold had been available, we would have use it.
The first production run of the 185R14 Phoenix ( without the curb guard) is not defective. We made a cosmetic change and established the 2nd generation of tire. This is not uncommon in the tire industry; we know this only too well. Regarding concessions - that's a custoner service issue best handled directly with the customer - not on a public forum - Jim
Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Thank you for your condolences - I considered carefully before sharing that information, but was encouraged to do so in a effort to stress that we make every effort to respond quickly to our customers with few exceptions.
Michelin has added the 185R14 MXV-P to their vintage or classic tire line - while they have indicated that this tire is available. they have not given us any costing information. we sent an inquiry to them today for that specific information. BY the way - Pneum Galacta has purchased the 185R14 Phoenix from us- Jim
Hauser - I doubt that the Michelin 185R14 has a ww - but we are going to ask. - Jim
-
Jim,
Thanks for your reply. Your time here says a lot about how seriously you take your customers, so it's much appreciated. Enthusiasts like us need suppliers like you.
I'd like to point out that I believe the Firestone Phoenix was indeed available in Europe and was often the original equipment tire on European W113 SLs, along with a similar tire from Continental.
In fact, my own experience was the opposite of what you described. My first SL was a Swiss 280SL with an original Phoenix spare and my current SL is a US-spec model with a Continental tire that has a very similar tread and sidewall pattern. The data cards on both cars confirm that these were indeed original equipment.
Finally, my condolences. We appreciate your time here.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
quote:
Originally posted by hauser
Albert, is this Michelin MXV-P available in a WW?
Hi Hauser,
I don't think so. I asked this to the Spanish importer some months ago, and he told me that Michelin is now producing only black wall tires of the MXV-P 185HR14. He also has ww kits to be glued on the black wall tires... but it's not the same...
But who knows? This MXV-P was out of production during some time, until Michelin decided to include it in its classic/vintage line... maybe they will introduce a ww version in the future... I guess it will depend on the market.
Regards
Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
-
Albert I don't know if it's just me but I really like the look of the WW on these cars. If an individual had white wall tires on their car it meant they added an extra option to the car. Perhaps Michelin would sell more tires if they had this option available. As for the glue on WW the JC Whitney Co. offered this option.
I remember an uncle of mine taking his 1967 Chevy II Nova to Portugal with him when he retired. He loved his WW so much he had them re-treaded because they were not available there at that time. He eventually had to go to black walls that did not due the car justice, especially with all that chrome.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
-
quote:
Originally posted by Jim Hildebrand
Michelin has added the 185R14 MXV-P to their vintage or classic tire line - while they have indicated that this tire is available. they have not given us any costing information. we sent an inquiry to them today for that specific information. BY the way - Pneum Galacta has purchased the 185R14 Phoenix from us- Jim
Hi Jim,
That's amazing: your company is listed by Michelin as the Michelin classic line importer for America, and you don't have costing information, when Pneum Galacta is selling this MXV-P 185HR14 since -at least- one year ago... It seems that Michelin is not interested in selling classic tires in America! [:0]
And yes, I knew about your Phoenix tires through Galacta. When I was looking for correct tires (size, speed rating, and better with curb guard) for my 230 SL -I had wrong 195/70 tires then-... it was really difficult. Kentaro from Galacta told me about your Phoenix as the only option, but just then he knew about the re-edition of the MXV-P, and I chose the Michelins.
Best regards
Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
-
Jim,
Thanks for your response and sorry for your loss.
I registered my desire to return the tires as soon as I learned that the rub stripe was omitted from the first production run. Adding the rub stripe is a tacit acknowledgement that the first run was faulty.
One could argue that I should have returned the tires 2 years ago.
Another fair argument is that I should have been notified by Coker that the rub stripe was omitted and offered a return and refund. In other words, take the burden off the customer and do what is right. This is what I expect out of a premium product at a premium price offered by a premium company.
I have not used the tires for more than 100 miles. I took them off because they road poorly.
At this point, I am expecting nothing from your company. It would not change my view of the tire-it is over priced, rides like they are filled with concrete and not backed by good customer service.
You can read my posts on this board. I have never had negative comments about vendors-only praise. In this case, I was compelled to keep other enthusiasts from making the same costly mistake I made.
Best,
Tom
_____________________________________________
1971 280sl Tunis Beige Metallic (restored & enhanced)
1971 280sl Tobacco Brown (low mileage stock)
_____________________________________________
-
Hi Guys
This might be a little off topic but here is the site for a tyre size calculator. If you know what size your original tyres should be, then you can determine how far your speedo will be out by changing the profile.
http://www.1010tires.com/TireSizeCalculator.asp
From what I can determine, my 230 SL was originally fitted with 185/78 14's and came with 70 profile tyres when I bought it. I recently replaced them with 185/75 R14's in a Sumitomo whitewall. They look good but tend to squeal when I push the car hard. I think I'll go for Michelins next time.
Mark
1965 230 SL light blue, auto, RHD
-
Bob -- I've done a lot of digging on this subject of tires, and like you, I'm about to go with a set of Bridgestone Turanza LS-Ts. Now that you've had yours for awhile how do you like them? Would you make the same choice again? I'm leaning toward a 205/70TR14 white wall. Your comments would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Tom in Boise
'71 280SL 4-spd Signal Red w/lt. tan leather
Originally posted by bpossel
Hi All,
This is such a great group of friends! Thank you for all of your replys!!!! The MX4's have been a good tire, and I have 3 with less than 10k miles if anyone is interested in them...
Anyway, based on your replys and since I drive the car on a regular basis, I have decided to buy the Bridgestone Turanza LS-T. It seems that not only some of our fellow 113 drivers have and like them, but they are also very well rated by Consumer Reports.
Again, Thank you all for your support!!!
Bob
-
quote:
Originally posted by bpossel
All,
When I bought my 280sl a few months ago, it came with Michelin P195/75 R14 Rainforce MX4's (Whitewalls). Yesterday I ran over something that cut the tire (not repairable).
Looks like I will need 4 new ones, whereas Michelin no longer makes the Rainforce MX4 and no longer makes whitewalls.
What tires do you have on your 113? What size? I read that the original size was 185/80 R14.
Bob
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
Bob and Tom,
Last summer I made a long post called Tire Nirvana; you can look this up and see what I found out with my tires, balancing etc. I have the Coker Phoenix and I found them remarkably better then Pirelli P400's I had. Tom Sargent, someone whose experience we all should respect, had a completely different take on them. Neither of us are wrong or crazy; clearly they were different on different cars. I have only chosen WW tires since that is what the car came with and the look that I like. I went back to the original tire size; the 205's would not mount in my trunk on the spare, and they rubbed the inner wheel well on a lock turn. It is pointless to debate which tire is better; I have not tried Michelins on my car. My cars suspension is completely stock and less then 4,000 miles on all components--no special springs, no Koni's, no urethane bushings, no large sway bar, etc. Exactly as it was supposed to be, with all its faults.
This summer one of the plans was to do some tire swapping at Joe Alexanders. Anybody coming there is welcome to give my Coker's a try.
Michael Salemi
1969 280SL
Signal Red w/Black Leather
Restored
-
Mike -- Thanks for the comments. I've been running Michelin MXV4s in size 205/70R14 for a number of years. Great tires, and no problems with fit. But they are getting old. And the beautiful photos of your car, and Tom's car, with those wonderful white walls convinced me that it is time for a change.
Tom in Boise
-
I've been using Bridgestone Turanza 205/70-14 LS-T blackwalls on my car and am quite happy with them. See also my post under the other topic on tires at http://sl113.org/forums/index.php?topic=2880
Chris
-
Hi Tom,
I ended up buying the Bridgestone Turanza LST 195/75 R14 Whitewalls last August. I have only put 1,900 miles on them so far, but am very satisfied with them. They seem to hold the road well and are quiet tires. I have a '97 E320 with Michelins and when I look at replacements, I will probably install the Bridgestones.
Good Luck!
Bob
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
-
I am currently trying to order the LS-T's here in Ireland in WW and 205's.
Its proving rather difficult but I really like the look of them and since Bridgestone tyres are supposed to be good in the rain it should suit me ! :(
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
-
Bob -- Thanks very much!
Was there a particular reason for choosing that size?
Also, do you know what the white wall width is? I have not seen one up close; amd the only info I can get is that the WW varies between 0.6 and 1.0 inch, which is quite a spread.
Tom in Boise
-
The WW width on the Bridgestone is .6" and the Coker is 3/4". The new Michelins have a narrower WW width. The Bridgeston Turanza and the NLA Michelin Rainfoce share the same WW width. I have Rainforce 195/75/14 on my car and have looked into suitable replacements. I'm really not sold on the Coker tires just yet. They're a very pricey tire especially when you consider the shelf life of a tire.
Tire shelf life has been discussed in an earlier post.
1969 280sl 5 spd
Gainesville, Fl.
-
Here is a good picture of the WW Bridgestone Turanza LS-T.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/BigPic.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=Turanza+LS-T&sidewall=White+Stripe+.6-1.0
Ed Cave
Atlanta, GA
1964 356C
1971 280SL
2002 SC430
2004 A4 3.0
-
Would a 195/75TR14 tire show accurate MPH on the US speedo as originally calibrated?
The Bridgestone tire discussed below does not come in a WW in a 185 - must use 195.
Ed Cave
Atlanta, GA
1964 356C
1971 280SL
2002 SC430
2004 A4 3.0
-
Hi Ed.
Here's a web site (sorry, it's Miata..., not MB) that helps calculate the speed difference with various tires sizes. It appears that with the 195's, when my speedo indicates 60MPH, I am actually going 61.4MPH
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
Bob
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
-
Bob, Ed -- In your opinions, is there a compelling reason to go with 195/75R14 vs. 205/70R14?
Tom in Boise
-
Hi Tom,
Not in my opinion. The size I ended up with was what my tire guy to get ahold of at the time. The price was also right....
Your speedo will be off an additional ~ mile or so when your at 60, will really be at ~62, but no issue with me...
Regards,
Bob
bpossel
Memphis, TN.
1971 280SL
1997 E320
-
quote:
Originally posted by Ed Cave
Would a 195/75TR14 tire show accurate MPH on the US speedo as originally calibrated?
Yes. According to the Tire Rack, a 185/80-14 Bridgestone (the original size) rotates 811 times per mile, and a 195/75-14 (or a 205/70-14) Bridgestone rotates 814 times per mile. So changing from one to the other would change a reading of 60 mph to a reading of 60.22 mph -- not enough of a change to notice. You'd probably get more of a difference by changing from one brand of tire to another.
Chris Earnest
-
Thanks Bob. Since I'm not pressed for time on this I think I'll probably order a set of Turanza LS-T 205/70R14s in WW.
Tom in Boise
-
This is a little off subject but has anyone had problem with trunk lid hinge rubbing on 195/75 spare? It rubbed a grove in the my tire cover. :evil:
Dick M
1970 280SL
-
Dick -- Until recently I've always had an original Continental 185/HR14 spare in the trunk. That's all I've ever had, and as might be expected with that original tire there was no observable contact with the trunk hinge.
Funny thing about that original Continental spare though. Not long after having bought the car (20 years ago) I noticed the spare didn't have air. I asked my local service people to take care of it. They said they did. Then maybe a year or two later I again noticed it had no air. After going through this slow leak-down problem multiple times I finally insisted they put a tube in it. They did NOT want to do that, but I held my ground, and when I picked the car up the bill reflected the cost of a new tube. The spare wasn't checked for years afterward, but more recently I noticed once again that the spare was flat. Then I finally saw that the old original Continental says right on the sidewall "Tube Type". I don't think the service people ever paid attention to that, and it was clear they simply did not want to put a tube in the tire. It also recently became clear that they'd never put a tube in, and that they'd lied when they said they did. The result was that I'd been driving around for the better part of 2 decades with a flat spare that was taking up a lot of trunk space.
As mentioned earlier, my interior guy will soon be redoing the trunk. And like a new SL my 280 will no longer carry a spare tire, but will instead have a nice little storage compartment built in for a can of "Flat Fix" along a small 12VDC compressor.
Tom in Boise
-
I remember in the past some serious safety concerns with the fix a flat. Mainly it is a flamable gas that can explode when you go to repair the tire. This may have been remedied in the newer product, I'm not sure. Also a tire can become debeaded or seriously blown out and fix a flat won't work. I think a spare is a nessasary evil to a motor car. It really is embarassing to be found dead in a great car like the Mercedes for any reason. I also have the 205/70 tires and the trunk hinge hits the spare. I plan on taking my spare mount to my fabricator and have him cut it down and reweld it for more clearence, if I have enough room to lower it.
-
I can't disagree with your sentiment about a spare tire. I know that my father, God rest his sole, would be highly PO'd about the idea of no spare.
However, new Mercedes models more & more come with no spare tire. Just a can of flat fixer and a small compressor in a nice little kit mounted in the trunk of new SLs as well as some other models. My lead mechanic described MB having done statistical studies on the issues of improving tire technology, cell phones, and statistical likihood of flats and the trade offs.
When I learned that my spare was still flat that finally convinced me. One thing I'm certain of: my wife is always PO'd because the 280SL doesn't have enough trunk space for her "stuff". I've got an ear-full for years about that. All the while I thought it was important to carry a spare, which in 20+ years I've never needed, and has in fact been flat the vast majority of the time anyway.
It's still a roll of the dice, but I think I'll follow the direction of Mercedes on this one.
Tom in Boise
-
quote:
Originally posted by graphic66
I remember in the past some serious safety concerns with the fix a flat. Mainly it is a flamable gas that can explode when you go to repair the tire. This may have been remedied in the newer product, I'm not sure. Also a tire can become debeaded or seriously blown out and fix a flat won't work. I think a spare is a nessasary evil to a motor car. It really is embarassing to be found dead in a great car like the Mercedes for any reason. I also have the 205/70 tires and the trunk hinge hits the spare. I plan on taking my spare mount to my fabricator and have him cut it down and reweld it for more clearence, if I have enough room to lower it.
I think I'll just buy a new inexpensive 185 to use as spare...If it ever gets used it will only be for drive to tire shop. Modifying the mount sounds like too much work ..$ I also like the idea of the "Flat Fix", "canned air" and no spare.
Let us know how the recontructed mount turns out..
Dick M
1970 280SL
-
Dick -- I recently drove a friend's brand new AMG-version SL600, aka SL65. A $200K car, with 600+HP and 700+FtLb of torque. An amazing car with amazing performance. But no spare; like all other new SLs just a can of flat fix and a tiny compressor.
I figure without a spare taking up valuable space in the 280SL's trunk I can listen more to the stereo, as opposed to my wife complaining...har! And I can carry a few more bottles of vino back from Napa Valley!
But to each his own on this one.
Tom in Boise
-
Of course, some of us have the luxury of a vertical spare! ;)
We actually run into our own troubles, as the metal brace that holds the tire is obviously for the original 185. I have a 195 in there, that fits in the trough fine but the brace doesn't quite make it.
Personally, I think a full-size spare (or close) on any car is worth the hassle.
James
63 230SL
-
quote:
Originally posted by TR
Dick -- I recently drove a friend's brand new AMG-version SL600, aka SL65. A $200K car, with 600+HP and 700+FtLb of torque. An amazing car with amazing performance. But no spare; like all other new SLs just a can of flat fix and a tiny compressor.
I figure without a spare taking up valuable space in the 280SL's trunk I can listen more to the stereo, as opposed to my wife complaining...har! And I can carry a few more bottles of vino back from Napa Valley!
But to each his own on this one.
Tom in Boise
You got my attention when mentioned increased capcity for wine transport... thanks
Dick M
1970 280SL
-
I have 205/70s and my trunk hinge doesn't hit my tire cover. I wonder if there is any difference because I don't have a rag top well?
Fix-a-flat? "Warning! Warning! Will Robinson!" I once used a new can of Fix-a-Flat on a Chevy with Mag wheels. The air got me home, but two days later, when I drove it to the shop, the tire was horribly out of balance. When we broke the tire down, the junk had decomposed into liquid and goo, and I had been slinging a puddle around inside the tire. It was a mess to clean up the wheel and do a real repair to the tire. I will never use that crap again. Even a donut spare is better than that.
Ray
'68 280SL 4-spd Coupe
-
I have a 205/70-14 spare tire in the trunk and although it is a tight fit, it does not interfere with the trunk lid hinge or anything else.
Cees Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic
-
When I bought a 205/70 14 spare, the boot lid closed but was rubbing on the tyre.
Within an hour I called the store and they were happy to replace it with a 185/80 14 for a small van.
Now the lid closes properly with no rubbing.
Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto
-
Interesting...the same size tire (205/70 or even 195/75) will rub in some cars and not in others. is it a difference in cars or difference tires?
Dick M
1970 280SL
-
quote:
Originally posted by hands_aus
When I bought a 205/70 14 spare, the boot lid closed but was rubbing on the tyre.
My 230SL came with a 205/70r14 spare tire (did not match the other tires!) and the spare tire cover, has or had, creases in it from the trunk hinge.
Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both tops
1994 E420
-
Is anyone using the new Michelin ENERGY MX1 tyres?
They have a 185/80R 14, speed rated T = 190kmph
Have a look here at their aussie site
http://www.michelin.com.au/tyres/passengerCar_energyXM1.asp
Any comments are welcome
Thanks
Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto
-
so... since the original 185 80 14 tire size isn't really available here in the US (other than coker), what would be an appropriate replacement size to avoid hitting the trunk?
185 75 14
195 75 14
195 70 14
Thanks,
Tom
-
That size is available. I bought a set of Michelin Agilis last year from tirerack.com, but there are several manufacturers who offer a tire in that size. Run a search through the forums and I'm sure you'll find more options.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
quote:
Originally posted by Douglas
That size is available. I bought a set of Michelin Agilis last year from tirerack.com, but there are several manufacturers who offer a tire in that size. Run a search through the forums and I'm sure you'll find more options.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
?? I tried, and get no matches for that size. Also looked at complete Michelin line on tirerack.com and don't see Agilis??
-
Run a search on tirerack.com for 185R14. Do not specify the profile. It'll give you 4 choices, including the Agilis.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
Bob Smith (Handsaus)
I also run the Michelin MX1 Energy T rated... I bought them at Sears in Vernon Hills Illinois and they gave me a free DVD player when I bought my set of four last year. I like them.
Before a recent trip to Ohio I bought one for my spare. It cost 72 dollars US.
Off topic....
Gas is three dollars here in Chicago
Hope all is well with everyone coping with Katrina.
Best Regards
Ernie
First Place AACA Show Winner 350SL July 2003
I love low mile Mercedes.
First Place AACA Show winner for 2004 280SL
1969 280 4spd Papyrus White
-
quote:
Originally posted by Douglas
Run a search on tirerack.com for 185R14. Do not specify the profile. It'll give you 4 choices, including the Agilis.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
Cool... got it... how do you like them?
-
I think the Agilis is a very good tire. I like the stiffness of the sidewall. My one and only complaint (aside from being slightly pricey) is that they look a little weird. They have a very aggressive tread pattern that looks slightly too aggressive on an SL.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
One day while browsing through items on ebay I came accross a Maxxis tire. I really don't know anything about this brand of tire. The one thing that did catch my eye was the rub strip. It may or may not be the elusive strip but merely an opticle illusion. I'll let you guys be the judges.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/14-INCH-MAXXIS-MA-1-TIRES-W-FREE-SHIPPING-195-75-14_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ66472QQitemZ7996880567QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW#ebayphotohosting
1969 280sl 5 spd
Gainesville, Fl.
-
Hey Ernie,
What are the noise levels like? The tread doesn't look too coarse.
Did you notice any difference in the handling and ride of the car?
What pressures you are using front and back?
I am hoping that with the correct tyre size the speedo readings
will be adjusted. I am not sure how 'out' they were.
They are $129.00 installed including 10% Gst, balancing and fitting.
I wonder if they will throw in a DVD player for me?? Ha Ha!
I am having them fitted tomorrow morning, so I will take the car for a short run.
Fuel is $1.18 a litre.
I am getting around town..
14.5 imperial MPG,
11.75 US MPG,
5km/l,
20.2 l/100km
Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto
-
Hello Bob in OZ
Tires are quiet. I like them very much, I run whatever they call for on the tire for pressure,
And all my pricey high dollar DVD players are broken, but the one that Sears/Michelin gave away with tires just keeps on working just fine. Go figure.
Cheers
Ernie
First Place AACA Show Winner 350SL July 2003
I love low mile Mercedes.
First Place AACA Show winner for 2004 280SL
1969 280 4spd Papyrus White
-
I am running Michelin Rainforce 185 Tr 14 tires. Very good tires. After my car is painted I am going to buy the colker Phenoix 185 HR 14 white walls Many of our member who did major restoration have given us good reports in handling and ride.
Bob Geco
-
Hey Ernie and Bob,
I had the new Michelin 185/80R 14 T (speed rating = 190Kmph) tyres installed on Saturday. They set them up with 34psi front and back.
They replaced 205 70 14 Mustangs which were on the car when I bought it 3 years ago.
The rear end doesn't look as fat as it used to.
The ride seems to be good without the same strong feel to the steering.
Ernie you are right, they are definitely quieter on the road. Next I would love to quieten the exhaust a bit.
I am going for a run next weekend for 4 days so I will get a really good 'feel' for the car.
The original tyres had a white wall on them but I didn't like the look so I bought some black tyre paint. The extra chrome rim on the 250sl, to me, made the wheels look too busy.
Thanks for your responses
Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto
-
Which Michelin? I wish the Michelin Rainforce was still available in the proper size, but it's not. Perhaps the Michelin Harmony can be had in that dimension.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
-
quote:
Originally posted by Douglas
Which Michelin? I wish the Michelin Rainforce was still available in the proper size, but it's not. Perhaps the Michelin Harmony can be had in that dimension.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
Hey Douglas,
The Michelin 'Energy' tyre.
Have a look at the website I listed in my 1st September posting.
Bob Smith (Brisbane,Australia)
RHD,1967 early 250 SL, auto
-
I add this as the thread gets viewed a lot by people such as I in the process of shopping around for tyres. Current price for the 'proper' Michelins in the UK is c£377!. So for those of us less well heeled be aware that alternatives are available: Vredestein Sprint Classic at c£140 (available from Mytyres) and Camac have one at c£89 from vintagetyres on Ebay. If like me you only need a spare, worth considering!