Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => Electrical and Instruments => Topic started by: TheEngineer on August 19, 2004, 21:25:52
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Best looking Fog Lights?
I’d like to install a pair of fog lights. Unfortunately I have no sense of aesthetics at all. So what do you guys think is the best looking arrangement for fog lights on our cars? Paul Bracq if you are out there, help me!
1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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Run a search on "fog lights" using the search feature on this site. I think new fog lamps look out of place on a Pagoda, so I'd look for a pair of good used ones from a 114 sedan. If they're not the same as the ones on a 113, they're nearly identical to my eye. They're Hellas and they're kind of flat and thin.
Personally, I think they look terrific, but believe they're out of place on a car with bumper guards. Too busy, in my opinion.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 230 SL 010.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Idle%20Swede/20048200151_230%20SL%20010.jpg)
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Here's one on my 114 sedan:
http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/douglas/200343020588_light.JPG
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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I have bounced this idea around for a while. To install fogs or not to install. I really like the look of the Hella . One problem about the Hellas is that they are no longer available and nice examples are hard to come by. The closest thing I found to duplicate these fogs are from PIAA. PIAA has an all chrome housing and very similar dimentions to the Hella. I will try to post a pic or two of the W113 with the Hella fog lights.
Here are the dimentions for the PIAA 520 SMR series.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) PIAAfog.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/200482003919_PIAAfog.jpg)
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1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Mmm something I've toyed with ! To be honest I could use good lighting but I think I prefer the look of the SL grille unspoilt !
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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Has anyone out there installed foglamps in a Pagoda without drilling holes in the bumper?
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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Dumb question: Why aren't the integrated fog lamps in the euro lights good enough? With a good reflector behind it, it should throw out sufficient candlepower. The bulbs can probably be upgraded, similiar to putting an H4 halogen in for the headlight bulb. They have an up/down directional adjustment to put the light where you want it. What more do you want?
Rodd
Powell, Ohio, USA
1966 230SL, Euro, Auto, Leather, both tops
1994 E420
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I agree..
If you have Euros , you have good fogs already..
and , like the H4 upgrade for driving beams, the fogs can also be
changed too..
I have done both to mine and they are excellent.
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Yeah thats true !
I have the upgraded halogen headlamp bulbs but I didn't know you could get the fog bulbs aswell ( Where ? ) but my reflectors could do with a clean and one of the adjusters for the fog lamps is busted !
Regards,
Ben in Ireland.
'64 230SL 4sp.
'03 CLK Kompressor
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I looked on eBay and eventually found these Hellas for my car. I would not have installed them, but the original owner had installed Lucas Square 8's (found on 69 & 70 Shelby's), which are rectangular. Thes Lucas' looked horrible so I removed them and it was cheaper to buy period Hellas to fill the holes than it was to replace the bumper.
Period Hellas and Bosch lamps can be found if you keep looking. I paid $40 for the pair.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 280SL - Front 1 10024.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/houstonbuckeye/200482010501_280SL%20-%20Front%201%2010024.jpg)
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Regards,
Stan
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Try the Demon Tweeks racing/rallying catalogue for different typs
Malc
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For rwmastel: Not a dumb question at all: My headlights are the american style and do not have fog lights in the lower half. I also don't have the forward marking lights (standing lights)whereas in the tail lights there is such a bulb, low wattage and switchable by turning the lightswitch to the left. But I do have a fog light circuit, it works and I have tested it by temporarily installing some Chinese lights under the bumpers.
For Ben: I've had the same impression in the back of my mind, but couln't vocalize it: The horns make it look busy!
1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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To A Dalton: What is the diameter and depth of those "original Hellas" and is the back chrome plated? write me e-mail at pjlange@juno.com
1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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Good subject, since I have put an order in for a pair of optional fog lights out of the W113 parts list 000 820 3156 H-1 bulbs 5 3/4 round. They are not the best looking fog light but they are peroid and factory. I also looked at Cibie who has some hansome peroid fog lights for driving and fog.
I have Bosch square lights on the bumper wired intop the light switch. It does a weard thing when switched all the way to the right the headlights go out but the lower perporation of the factory USA fog lamp remains on with the Bosch lamps is this correct?
Bob Geco
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Here is a U.S. spec '71 sporting Hella fog lights.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 71280hellafog.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/2004820152020_71280hellafog.jpg)
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1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Here is a really nice looking Hella on a BMW 2002tii. Although not used by Mercedes it is still beautiful.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) hella fog 144.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/2004820153248_hella%20fog%20144.jpg)
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1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Front view U.S. lights with the Hella fogs.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 71280fogs.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/2004820154222_71280fogs.jpg)
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I also have an awesome shot of a Euro model with the same fogs but it is in the form of a photograph. My scanner is down for the moment but will post asap.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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To Bob Geco (krwaxbc): I traced the wiring and found that the fog light circuit is via a separate fuse box in front of the regular fuse box which contains 12 fuses. This separate fuse box has two stations for fuses, but only one is wired: That one has power only when the parking lights are on: The switch on the dash is one click to the right. When you pull the switch out, the fog lights come on (together with whatever is on for parking lights) The fog lights go out in any other switch position. Where the Euro model headlights have the fog light, I have the directional blinkers. Therfore, when your switch is all the way to the right, the fog lamps go out, the headlights come on and the parking lights remain on.
1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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A Dalton
I am interested in your hellas fog lights. Email me at tuultyme@comcast.net.
I saw a Pagoda on Ebay with a bracket that came up from under the bumber around the front. This would be an idea if you wanted to only use them for trips and remove them for a show. I will see if I can find the listing.
Bruce; 268Blaugrun(green) 1970 280SL; IL
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Look at Ebay item #2487475503. May look better if chrome. Not for everyone but an alternate in drilling the bumper.
Bruce; 268Blaugrun(green) 1970 280SL; IL
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Bruce I think the brackets are too long causing a serious vibration problem. If severe enough you will actually see the light projection bouncing around.
Doug I don't think you could get very good results if you anchored these lights other than on the bumper. I do want to show you this unique piece for the foglights. As you see in the pic below if one were to use this type of bracket and turn it around you could hide the nuts and bolt.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 190slfogbracket.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/2004821131221_190slfogbracket.jpg)
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Hauser, I've seen fog lights held on quite nicely with screw-down clamps that slide onto the side of the bumper. I saw that on a BMW and would think it's possible to fabricate something like that for an SL. Just wondering if anyone has ever seen it done on an SL.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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Dough it may be possible to fabricate a custom bracket that would anchor to the mounting bolts of the front bumper.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Much thanks to all of you who provided valuable input. The observation that it would be best not to drill holes in the bumper made me use existing holes on the underside of the bumper. As you correctly observed, that way, if desired for show, the lights can be removed without trace. When the lights are installed below the bumper, it leaves the grille exposed and visually only obstructed by the horns: As you observed: “With round foglights and the horns it looks too busy”. There is still enough road clearance: The lowest part to touch a curb is still the radiator drain valve (Ouch!) at 8 inches off the ground. I made two small brackets in the shape of a “Z” which raise the mounting studs of the lights ¾ inch and bring them back and inboard a little. And my wife approves of the appearance. THANK YOU !
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) MyFogLts.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/theengineer/200482219851_MyFogLts.JPG)
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1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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An absolutely stunning picture, and the lights looks good to. :)
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I did some hunting for the orginal Hella fog lamps part #000 820 3156 and they are discontinued. The best price I found was on one new one out of Europe for $300.00 . The nearest lamp to the hella in deminsion and style is from Cibie called tango driving & fog chrome backing 5 3/4 $85.00 each.
Bob Geco
B
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Theengineer,
nicely done, car and fogs look great!
George Davis
'69 280 SL Euro manual
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Have a look at Hella's latest Comfort Line 'Comet 500'
Nice size: 163mm dia x 67mm deep.
Would not look out of place on a 113 in my opinion.
Can buy adapter mountig set which suggests may be able to mount without drilling bumper.
naj
65 230SL
68 280SL
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Check Ebay auction #2488102634
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Does anyone know the diameter of these lights on ebay? The 230sl at the Classic Center in Germany has the Bosch units. You can see a pic of the car on sltech site with Gernold up front.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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Here's one snatched off the Web that looks to have the original Hellas:
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 51_3.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/douglas/200498232543_51_3.JPG)
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(Very busy looking with those bumper guards & foglamps!)
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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I found this site with pictures of the fog lights.
http://www.hank-tinhoer.de/pics/i02.JPG
Gerard Wuisman
1970 280sl
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I don't think those are the period lights for a 113. They look too big and the base is too large.
Douglas Kim
New York, NY
280 SL #016220
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Sorry for the late post - I just came across this subject today. Recently installed a pair of clear IPF ZE-1 lamps bought from Adventure Accessories 1-888-600-4268. Removed the driver side front tow ring and mounted the lights onto and under the frames on both sides by drilling holes for two #10 sheet metal screws for each lamp. They nestle in with the horns and look very inconspicuous and consume 55 watts each but are advertized to shed 110 watts of light. Wired them to a three way toggle switch under the dash with a center off position and connected to the floor switch to go on with the high beams or "on" if you want to run them without the headlights. The lamps come with a wiring kit complete with relay, wire, connectors, etc. in a plug-and-play package. These are small and might be what you are looking for!
Les 1970 280SL
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Here is another picture of a '71 280sl with fog lights.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 71 280fog.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/200499194338_71%20280fog.jpg)
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1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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I have mine a bit closer-spaced. Any opinions about this?
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) waqas230slfogs.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Waqas/20049116744_waqas230slfogs.jpg)
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waqas
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1965 230 SL Euro, 4sp. man
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Waqas - your car looks great! And I prefer the look of the bumpers without the extra US-spec overriders. However, I think I like the wider spacing on the car that Hauser posted the picture of, better. Having said that, as much as I would like to add fog lights, in my opinion the car looks better without any. "Less is more". Of course, that's just my personal opinion!
Cees Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic
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<<in my opinion the car looks better without any. "Less is more". Of course, that's just my personal opinion.<<<
I agree.. and considering you already have them in the Euro package..
why add them ??
That is what is so cool about Euros .. ALL the lighting is in the one package , along with the City lamps...
Smooooooth....
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Here is the second version:
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) Fogs v. 2.JPG (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/theengineer/2004911124444_Fogs%20v.%202.JPG)
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1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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Cees- thanks for the kind words. If it's possible to have an affair with a car, I'm certainly in the middle of a stormy one with mine... some days when I drive in to the office, I just can't bear to turn away from her :oops:
I agree with you on the bumper guards- they really detract a great deal from the graceful lines in front. As far as the foglights, I believe they are Cibie Iode-45 (from the 70s?), and were already installed by the previous owner... and I don't have those chrome 'plugs' to fill the bumper holes if I remove them. I might experiment with placement though. Are those plugs still available?
Here's another view of my dear mistress:
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) waqas230slfogs2.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Waqas/200491117350_waqas230slfogs2.jpg)
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waqas
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1965 230 SL Euro, 4sp. manual
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The small chrome caps are available through any car parts store - not MB but I have them on my bumpers and they look very good: very inconspicuous. They are called "antenna caps", are typically chromed plastic with a small plastic gasket, and are available in various sizes. WHen the time comes for me to have my bumpers re-chromed, I will have the holes (from the bumper overrider bolts) closed.
Cees Klumper in Amsterdam
'69 white 280 SL automatic
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Here's another pic of a 230sl 5 speed with euro lights and aux fog lights.
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 230slZF5.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/hauser/20049141633_230slZF5.jpg)
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1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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<whoops> I seem to have some strange activity going on in my browser. tried to go back and my days-old reply got posted again. false alarm! no updates to the thread!
umm.. nice zf5 there, Hauser...
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quote:
Originally posted by A Dalton
<<in my opinion the car looks better without any. "Less is more". Of course, that's just my personal opinion.<<<
I agree.. and considering you already have them in the Euro package..
why add them ??
That is what is so cool about Euros .. ALL the lighting is in the one package , along with the City lamps...
Smooooooth....
Agree 100%: we already have fog lights in the Euro headlights... just pull the lights switch (I'm sure some W113 owners don't know they already have fog lights in their cars). I also love the look of the car without any additional fog lights, but... if you prefer it with that extra lights, please find attached the picture of one Pagoda from the MB Museum... It's supposed to have the correct extra fog lights...
Regards
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) 230 SL museu2.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Albert-230SL/20049145297_230%20SL%20museu2.jpg)
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Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
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Albert,
Interesting colour combination in that picture.....
I think the roof is blue yes :?:
Malc
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Yes, Malc
Blue metallic
naj
65 230SL
68 280SL
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quote:
Originally posted by naj
Yes, Malc
Blue metallic
naj
I think so... the color combination is funny, but I don't like its chrome wheel archs either. I think MB should have a more original (or standard) Pagoda in the Stuttgart Museum... Some people could think that all W113 originally had these items, because this is the only Pagoda on display in the Museum...
Attached is another picture (in bigger detail) of the fog lights in this MB Museum Pagoda.
Regards
Download Attachment: (http://images/icon_paperclip.gif) Museum-fog.jpg (http://www.sl113.org/forums/uploaded/Albert-230SL/200491475019_Museum-fog.jpg)
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Albert de la Torre Chavalera
Barcelona (Catalunya/Spain)
Feb.'64 230 SL Euro 113042-10-002432
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Dumb question here. Why are they called fog lights instead of running lights? Don't fog lights have special bulbs? I thought these lights on the bumpers were for extra illumination at high speeds, rather than for seeing through fog.
Joe2
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Joe: Not a dumb question at all: Most of the lights they are talking about in this thread are high intensity driving lights. They are mounted on top of the bumper. The first person to do so was Eugen Böhringer for the 1963 Spa-Sofia-Liege Rally. (ref. MB Classic magazine 1-2003) They are switched on by a switch installed on a panel mounted where the radio normally goes and labeled "Weitstrahler". I did install true fog lights below the bumper so that they would illuminate the fog from below, as close to the ground as feasible. They light up together with the parking lights, because the low beam lights would cause more reflected light in fog; and it's not per the law. My fog lights also have a very narrow horizontal beam because they are european lights. Please note: IMHO there is no such thing as a dumb question; it's only that the person asked may label it as such, because they don't know the answer, or don't want to answer. I'll probably never use my fog lights, because it doen't get as foggy here as in Germany. At least, I have never seen it as foggy here. Over there, I have seen fog so thick, you couldn't see 6 feet. That pretty much stops traffic. But I installed the fogs because I had an extra circuit and switch already for it.
1969 280SL,Signal Red, A/T, P/S, A/C, Both tops. Ret. engr. 1967 230SL - Sold
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quote:
Originally posted by Joe
Dumb question here. Why are they called fog lights instead of running lights? Don't fog lights have special bulbs? I thought these lights on the bumpers were for extra illumination at high speeds, rather than for seeing through fog.
Joe2
Joe, you can have two identical lights one for fog and the other for driving. The difference is in the lens. They both use the same housing they may even use the same H1 bulb. The lens determins the light pattern.
1969 280sl 5 spd 1999 ML320 Gainesville,Fl.
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The optional foglights on the W113 cars are the same light used on the W114/115 models. They don't work well at all, and imho, they take away from the elegant lines of this car.
tom in CA
2003 C320 Coupe