Pagoda SL Group
W113 Pagoda SL Group => General Discussion => Topic started by: UJJ on July 25, 2013, 12:58:09
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Massachusetts is one of the states where a front license plate is required. I think this looks quite ugly in front of my car and I am wondering if any of you have some experience either with our law enforcement friends and/or with passing the annual safety inspection if the front plate is removed or replaced by more appropriate sign. 280SL 1968 would be nice!
I see many Pagodas, including cars registered in MA without any front plates or with plates of their owners liking, so there must be a way.
I try to avoid driving around carrying bribe doughnuts in the case I get stopped. :D
Have any of you got harassed doing so?
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California has the same law - front plate required. It used to be no big deal and was not enforced ... however I have received a ticket for not having a front plate on a daily driver. It was a fix-it ticket that was a real pain to get cleared up. In the past few years, I have known several friends who have been ticketed for this ... we believe the reason they are now enforcing this is because of the many cameras installed at traffic lights. Many of these take a shot head-on and capture the plate and the driver in one-shot. Again, this is California ... the state is very hungry to keep the funds rolling in ...
Also, many large USA airports have a few police stationed at the entrance ... ready to stop anyone ... and in Los Angeles they are stopping and ticketing for lack of front plates at the airport.
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On my various old cars I have put the magnet tape that's got adhesive on one side on the license plate. I attach the plate if I drive in Arlington County or the District, where the police are mercilessly detail-oriented. Fairfax County where we live seems to be more tolerant about such things.
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My State (NE) recently adopted a category called "special interest."
It is for collector cars that aren't used as daily transportation.
Costs $50/year which includes personalized message plate and no required front plate.
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Seems like Vettes and Porsches have a free pass here in CA. Never see a front plate on those cars. Always had a plate on my SL but drilled a couple of holes in each side of the plate to center it on the bumper. Have got used to it being there over the years :)
John
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Many states have, for cost reasons, eliminated the front plate requirement. Maybe CA still has too many in prison and they need to keep them busy?
We don't have a front plate here, but some buy them for fun! Not required.
Speaking of cost reduction, Massachusetts, in a fit of wisdom and cost reduction, stopped sending out driver's license renewals; you have to remember yourself and do it yourself. When in Massachusetts last February, I polled the people at a party I was at. All pulled out their licenses, and fully 50% had expired!
Monday saw a run to the registry! :D
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Ontario requires front plates. You're right, the traffic cams and homeland security issues probably motivate the regulations nowadays.
Benz Dr put a bracket on my bumper that holds the plate a few cms in front. I like the effect of the "floating" licence plate.
If we were permitted to lose the front plate, I would ask you all about the flat section of the front bumper. With no plate, wouldn't our cars look even better if the front bumper were all one piece and didn't have the smushed in portion?
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Peter, I think our cars would look even better without the concave section to allow the mounting of Euro plates. A full continues front bumper would give our car more class. This has been discussed many a times in other car forums. I guess most European car manufactures have gone away from this front bumper concave plate mounting area. I remember back as far as the 80s my German cars all had the continues bumper up front. In Alberta (as well as other Provinces) we needed no front plates.
I don't know why they don't make it a standard across North America and do away with that front plate. I guess they want to keep the boys busy in them prisons :) Oh well.
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Interestingly enough, I don't know of one country in Europe that does not require front plates. They all do AFAIK.
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Maybe CA still has too many in prison and they need to keep them busy?
You might be right there Michael, but things are looking up here in the Golden State these days. At least no salted roads so our cars don't exhibit too much rust. And as to Pebble Beach always being cold and foggy. That is true certain times of the year and usually only when a certain a famous Golf tournament is played and sometimes during the Concours. Otherwise it is a spectacular place! Still, way too many people in the cities but up here where we live in foothills of the Sierras, life ain't bad :)
John (A California native, if you couldn't tell)
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[Benz Dr put a bracket on my bumper that holds the plate a few cms in front. I like the effect of the "floating" licence plate.
pj:
That sounds interesting. Do you have a picture of it?
Thanks, Urban
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this is before I put a clear plastic cover over it, but I think it shows what I was talking about.
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Thanks for the picture. It certainly looks better.
Urban
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to echo what Cess said about Europe, while all countries here require the front plate, some in the past were wise enough to make it less obtrusive.
I was aways envious of Italian front plates that were very small, thus much less noticeable than those from other countries. Also, Belgium and Luxembourg used to have smaller sizes than elsewhere. Unfortunately, the EU unification craze did not miss the opportunity to impose that member states have the same size… obviously being the largest possible one :) and put on both ends of the car.
BTW, T think that the best looking plates used to be those from Monaco, but then their rarity has been in direct relation to the size of the country… No idea what is the present situation as technically, Monaco is not part of the EU.
Some EU countries have adopted special rules for vintage cars, evidenced by specific plates. In Poland these have yellow background (as opposed to white in general case). There is also a vintage car sketched on the plate, which I find amusing but of questionable relevance to Pagodas and other Porches that have more contemporaneous features than that.
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I remember when I saw a Jaguar E Type in London back in ’65 with the large front plate mounted on the bonnet. Painful to look at.
John
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That used to be quite common here, on cars with aerodynamic front ends - they were "stick on " plastic sheet plates,
to which you then stuck the numbers and letters on .
Paul
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Like this on my Jag last year. Easy to stick on and can be removed. The hard plate was really difficult to fit and always scraped on the ground when you opened the bonnet/hood
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I'm not required to have a front plate on my Pagoda anymore, so I don't. I used to leave the front license plates off all my cars and just pay the Illinois fines -- they totaled about the same dollar premium annually as would a vanity or personalized plate. So aesthetics ruled over the law or even the 'origin' argument that if Germans all put front license plates on their German cars, then that's the way it should be; and I should put one on the front of my German car, too.
But now I proudly display the front plate on my daily driver, a Tesla S. Illinois EV plates are sequentially numbered and it's a kind of a signal to those who are interested of how long ago or how early in the production run I bought mine. It's nice not to wonder when I'm going to get my next ticket -- but mostly it's funny how circumstances can completely reverse a deeply held point-of-view on something like this.
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What's interesting and odd regarding this subject specific in Massachusetts is the fact that plates here have been red letters/numbers on white background for quite some time. There was a period however when plates were green on white and yes...only one plate per car was issued. Some of those plates are still registered so if you have a car with green/white, you ONLY have one plate and that obviously goes on the back.
Personally, its my belief that you PROBABLY won't get pulled over in Massachusetts for having just one plate or at least one be fined if you do. I would bet that if you were in an accident or had some alternate infraction then they could add the one plate thing to your ticket. But don't go by me...I've had my car hear since 2007 and never had a State inspection sticker either!
PS: I do lots of driving in Connecticut!
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Virginia is one of the states that require front plates too. However, I run a german plate on front, and a Va. antique plate on rear. Then I carry my front antique plate in my drivers door pocket in case of being stopped. If stopped, I "forgot to replace my front plate". Have been doing this for 11 years, and have traveled far, never been stopped. Knock on woor.
Bob
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I guess it's like this: if the authorities approach you head on, and see no plate, they have no idea whether you are from a one plate state with no requirements, or a two plate state with. By the time they pass you and look in their rear view mirror, make a determination, do they put their lights on, do a 180 and chase you down? It's all kind of silly.
Once I got a ticket for [my intent was avoiding a huge traffic mess] for "use of private property to avoid a traffic control device." Months later at a city breakfast I sat next to district court judge who said "I'd have thrown that (dismissed) that waste out of my court in a heartbeat".
You never know what you will run into...
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In Texas, a new just started Sept. 1 that requires a front plate and a $200 fine if you are caught without it. I was doing the same as Bob and had a French Euro plate on the front and an old 1970 Texas plate on the rear. I am looking for a license plate bracket to convert the European wider holes in the bumper to the narrower US plate locations. I would prefer one that is not the same rectangular shape as a Euro plate with extra holes, but instead a US sized backing plate with tabs or ears that reach out. I can't find it online yet...any ideas?
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Bud's Benz sells a nice front license plate holder:
http://www.budsbenz.com/catalog/200/N%20-%20Miscellaneous
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Bud's Benz sells a nice front license plate holder:
http://www.budsbenz.com/catalog/200/N%20-%20Miscellaneous
The greatest value in the Bud's product is the nicely manufactured and angled nylon spacers. Unfortunately that front "plate" that is supposed to back the license plate is sized for something I have not seen...maybe a German tourist plate or something but it is too small for one of those ersatz EU plates (like I have) or any standard US plate.
However, what I did was go to a metals shop with the dimensions of the plate I needed, had one cut out of hard plate aluminum, drilled it myself, and used the Bud's mounting gear. If anyone needs the little useless plate I think I still have it... ;)
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Chip, If it were me, I'd take a trip to a "Pull your own Part Junkyard" There are many imported vehicles that have the type of bracket you are looking for. Look at the BMW'S and other imported vehicles. Many of those have front brackets that I'm sure could be modified to work. Just drill a few holes in the bracket and you'll be in business.
RB6667
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Michael,
why do you think Bud's holder is too small for a standard US license plate? Does Michigan issue plates on steroids? ;)
The only very minor issue I can see is that the holder doesn't cover the slits in the bumpers completely.
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Michael,
why do you think Bud's holder is too small for a standard US license plate? Does Michigan issue plates on steroids? ;)
The only very minor issue I can see is that the holder doesn't cover the slits in the bumpers completely.
There you go with the insults again, Alfred. I don't THINK the Bud's holder is too small, it is too small for me. When I invest in a costly front plate (either the EU vanity plate I have, or an optional standard sized Michigan front plate) I want this plate protected from bending. This requires, for me, backing. Full backing, not some partial backing.
As you can see from what Bud's sent me, the backing/mounting plate is NOT the same size as a US standard plate; it isn't nearly as tall in the height. There's no reason why they could not make it the size of a standard US plate. When I asked them about it they said, "yeah, the plate will hang over...no big deal". Well, it was for me--particularly since I was using a wider EU plate.
In my particular case, I also wanted a chrome/metal (not plastic) frame for the front EU plate. The only one I could find was one that had metal tabs that bent around the plate and backing. Also, I did not want any advertising frame, such as what you have, or one advertising a dealer or anything. Just a simple, plain, thin chrome metal frame which is what I have front (EU) and back (USA). My own personal choice.
If I chose to have a duplicate front US plate, OR I lived in a state that required one, I would have done things exactly the same way, but had a backing plate cut to size to match a US plate instead of the EU plate I have.
If anybody wants that off-sized Bud's Plate, let me know... :)
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Michael,
I am sorry if I insulted the Michigan DMV - it was meant as a joke.
Good luck in your quest finding THE perfect license plate holder.
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Seems like Michael found his perfect plate, only in two different places with some homework in addition. The Buds plate looks like it may be just about ok for Swiss front plates, these are pretty small (though not quite as small as the Italian ones).
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I purchased this holder and am very pleased. It attaches via the "euro" slots in our front bumpers and adapts to a US plate hiding nicely behind it.
http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/ksearch/pel_search.cgi?SUPERCAT_FLAG=Y&make=MBZ&please_wait=N&forumid=&threadid=&command=DWsearch&description=126-817-02-11-M22++++&I1.x=6&I1.y=12
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Seems like Michael found his perfect plate, only in two different places with some homework in addition. The Buds plate looks like it may be just about ok for Swiss front plates, these are pretty small (though not quite as small as the Italian ones).
Cees, my neighbor bought a Porsche Caymen on Euro delivery, and still has his "tourist plate". I think the tourist plate is the same as the Bud's plate size.
Yes, what I did works for me, though I can tell you that the aluminum I fabricated it out of was some kind of hardened plate aluminum, and is pretty tough stuff.
Bud's ought to sell just their hardware!
Alfred, I have had my license plates in order for about 10 years now...all is well. :)
Curiously, US-standard sized license plate backers of varying kinds are available, solid--in metal and plastic in a variety of styles and forms. Nearly all are the full size of the US standard plate, which had me puzzled as to what Bud's was doing...no matter, as Cees said--I did it myself.
Hardware is first class, by the way.
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Kevin,
Thanks for the lead. I went to the local MB dealer and used my MBCA discount to get the MB part 126-817-02-11 directly from them, for a grand total of $8.50 + tax.
It fit perfectly on installation, and is completely hidden by the U.S. license plate, but backs it completely for support.
Chip
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Michael,
if you want to have a nice metal holder for your EU front plate, have a look at the Mercedes-Benz Classic store page. These are metal frames with the Mercedes Benz Classic name on it. Not cheap, but good quality and I think they latch well our Pagoda style
http://www.mercedes-benz-classic-store.com/Licence-Plate-Brackets-Mercedes-Benz-Classic.htm?websale8=classic-store.English&pi=B66055631
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PLASTIC NUMBER PLATE HOLDERS? ARE YOU SURE? :o :o
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Stan,
The front license plate issue was solved a long time ago. However--thank you for the link. The only issue with MB Classic stuff for us here, is the shipping I would guess. It was hard enough for me to subscribe to the MB Classic Magazine (they had my credit card information I sent them on the form but chose not to process it; instead, they just kept sending warning notices about overdue invoices!) that I am not sure I want to try mail-order hard goods!
It looks very nice, and the quality as described should be fine. My solution is just a bit less elegant, but works just fine. I don't know if I'd have to do this again!
I still have the plastic plate holder, for another car at another time, I guess... ;)
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Michael,
Your welcome. As for the MB Classic Magazine, I had exactly the same issues. I felt like major debt offender. ;). Then I could a very pleasant alternative: if you become member of the MB Club of the UK, not only you get their superb monthly Magazine (which is about all, usually vintage, Mercedes cars), but you also get the MB Classic Magazine included in the package. The dues (in the case of overseas members) are 48 GBP for 1 year or 88 GBP for 2 years. Not that it is some kind of crypto-advertising, but this works great and I consider it a decent value for money.
https://www.mercedes-benz-club.co.uk
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I live in a state that does not require a front plate. This is fine with me, although when I took a field assignment in New Jersey for my job I drove my daily driver up to NJ (not the SL) and used it in Atlantic City (Ventnor beach to be exact) where I worked. I have never been tailed by so many police in my life, in coastal NJ when they see no front plate so they automatically swing around to see if they can get you for not having a front plate ($$$ for the city coffers) or if you were from out of state. I was constantly tailed all the way home many times by beachside police waiting for me to break any driving law. I guess they figure if you are from out of state the likelyhood is you will pay a ticket rather than come back to their courthouse to contest it. My advice from living beachside NJ is if you have NJ car and visit Atlantic City area you had better have both plates on at all times.
Interesting enough, I do have a front license plate on my 250SL the original one from Germany looks great and gives the car that original European look.
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On this site, there is a bill of materials for a license plate holder (could be from a 107) that I ordered from the local MB dealer. With all of the screws spacers and the plate, I think it came to $14.00.
Looks great and I stay out of trouble with these pesky Ohio plate laws.
Mike Mizesko
Columbus OH
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Then I could a very pleasant alternative: if you become member of the MB Club of the UK, not only you get their superb monthly Magazine (which is about all, usually vintage, Mercedes cars), but you also get the MB Classic Magazine included in the package.
So, for this UK membership, you get TWO magazines? MB Classic PLUS their monthly Gazette? If that's the case it sounds like a deal...
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So, for this UK membership, you get TWO magazines? MB Classic PLUS their monthly Gazette? If that's the case it sounds like a deal...
That's absolutely right :)