Pagoda SL Group
Off Topic => Other cars => Topic started by: twistedtree on July 18, 2012, 20:27:15
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I'm curious to what extent you guys tend to be fans of a particular automobile brand (MB, for example), versus fans of specific models of cars, more or less independent of brand? I had never really thought about it before, but realize I have very little brand affinity or loyalty, but rather have particular cars that I like that span a variety of brands. A lot of this stems from reading MBCA articles which understandably are all about the brand, and finding that I just can't relate to it very much.
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I think you and I are like most of us here: very fond of the Pagoda, not that interested in other Mercedes models, new or old (with one notable exception, being the 300 SL :D
Some here have other Mercs in their signature. Me I have a '73 Chevy and two modern Volvo's in the line--up. My wife would press for any next modern car to be a Volvo (she really did not like our last modern Merc). So there you are!
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There's probably something in-between a specific model and the brand - which is a 'model line' - I have always been a fan of the MB SL-line (some models more than others like the W113 of course) and the the BMW 3-series line (have had 8 BMW's - (6) were within the 3-series line). I also am a fan of the 911 Porsche line (again some models are better than others).
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For me it is only Mercedes Benz, I like almost every model particulary the older models. I don't know why, but that's the way it is.
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I think you and I are like most of us here: very fond of the Pagoda, not that interested in other Mercedes models, new or old (with one notable exception, being the 300 SL :D.....
Oh my, oh my, how can you forget the other Braq car, the W111 coupe ?? :o
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Doug, that is how I feel. I am a huge fan of VW's between '64 and '67, BMW 2's until '76, Alfa GTV's between '67 and '71, and W113's...all.
g
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Oh my, oh my, how can you forget the other Braq car, the W111 coupe ?? :o
Car? You mean cars, right? The 112, 600, etc.
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No! ;D
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I have a thing for Mercs - like the look of the new SLK but not the SL. Like the C and the GLK but not their bigger siblings but I think I am not that loyal....
Which is why I recently bought a Range Rover Evoque and hanker after an old 911
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I am all things German. Enjoy Mercedes have owned an E320, SLK 320, CLS 500, C63 AMG, C350 and currently own an E550. Owned numerous BMWs..3 series, 5 series and 7 series. Owned an Audi GT Coupe many years ago. Next car will hopefully be a 911. The Germans really know how to build cars. So...why did I buy Range Rover Sport? My wife loves them!
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I see a mix here, some like only Benz automobiles, some like German, and some like me, have cars are all over the map. Frankly I have had mixed experience with a newer Benz car and likely will try other brands for a while - and my last name is Benz! I think Japanese cars are more reliable - but boring as mayo on white bread :)
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I think Japanese cars are more reliable - but boring as mayo on white bread :)
I got a good laugh out of this one, Chuck.
In a recent NYTimes test of the Prius C, the reviewer described it as "transportation between point A and point B--and you better have a gurney at point B because you'll be dead from boredom."
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I like many cars. I came to MB through a W108 3.5 when I was a student. It was cheap, it was a V8 and I liked the look of the grill and the vertical stacked lights. I then came to appreciate the build quality as I work on my cars a lot. I like the MB design of the 60s, apart from the 600 which I find too squarish. The design I like most is the W111 Coupe.
The other car I like most, may be even more than these MBs, is the Citroen DS. For different reasons of course. It's a crazy car, my grandfather owned one which I ended up getting and I drove a lot in it. At that same period I had a pristine W109 6.3. On long trips the DS was more comfortable. And to the French (which I am) the DS is really a special car. it was everywhere in the 70s so it brings back a lot of childhood memories.
I also like BMWs of the same era. I owned a '72 Inka orange 2002 when I was a student, and it is the car I regret most selling. I also own a '72 3.0 csi.
I also took a lot of pleasure driving an Alfa Romeo 2000 GTV which I did not keep very long. I hope I will own a Busso powered V6 Alfa one day.
I like many other cars, too many to list. I don't know what is driving it. It can be several models of a same make (like for Mercedes, BMW, Jaguar) or one model of a given make like the DS.
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I've been found of the German car for several reasons. First I did watch my dad take his engine (it was a Mercedes I have no clue what model it was I do remember the star ~ until they took the car away from him for the war effort) apart and carefully label most of the important components. Second when I was a teenager doing a summer job in Germany I was allowed to wash the business owners Mercedes the year was 1954 and I was 17 :) It was the highlight of my week driving that Benz Limo in and out of the garage. The car looked something like this ---> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Mercedes-Benz_300_1954.jpg I dont remember the sun roof.
When I came to Canada I once drove my sisters boyfriend's Mercedes around the block a few times (I never told him or her about it hehehe) of course I had no licence at the time. I drove mostly american (crappy used cars) cars before I purchased our first new car it was a 1961 red VW Beattie.
I always had a spot for the Benz and the Bimmer in my system. My first new Benz I test drove was a Pagoda in the early 60's I could only dream to own one at the time since the price tag was slightly over $9,000- Canadian at that time.
I could recognize a Bimmer or a Benz from far away and often told my wife "look at that" In 1987 I did purchase my first brand spanking new Bimmer it's still in our family and I don't think it will ever be sold. In 2004 I fell in love with an M3 and drove several of them since then. I also owned several Mercedes' (350 LM, 300 AMG and a C350). Once I fond my now Pagoda I sold the C350 a few weeks ago.
So is it about the brand or the car I guess in my case I have to say both ... now having my M3 and the Pagoda I like to think I have something old and beautiful and something new and unique since this is the last year they are building the 420 HP V8 M3 ... next series M3's will be 6 Cylinder and Twin Turbo cars.
(http://alterpeter.smugmug.com/Cars/Mercedes-280-SL/i-q7GtPXh/0/M/Optimized-Ohoto%204%20of%204-M.jpg)
I call it my little dream garage (Pity we have to wait soo long to finally achieve some of our dreams)
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Great idea for a discussion topic! For myself, I might respect a brand more or less for its success over the years, and certainly MB has been successful and played a leadership role in (almost?) every sector of the land-based transportation industry all around the world right since the very beginning, so it's hard to imagine giving the nod to any other brand over MB.
But the details that I look for in a vehicle are specific to each model and each variant of each model. So whether I like a car or not is almost not dependent on the brand at all. Sure, vehicles are useful in so many different situations. You have to acknowledge that an inexpensive, reliable car serves a purpose in our society: even the poor folks need to get around. What I admire is the concept that there is something beyond mere utility, i.e. more than just mayo on white bread. You could call it "art," but that is only the beginning. When a person buys a car that does more than just meet their minimum needs, they are expressing a sentiment about civilization. It implies a confidence, not just in the car, but in the other aspects of life where the resources wrapped up in the car might otherwise have been used. It could be an expression of the exhilaration of driving. It might depend on shapes and curves, or even be tied to colour. And surely there are trends and fashions that reflect the times of the design. (Think fins.) How a car leads or follows fashion is a tribute to the cleverness and flair of the designers, and to the audacity of the corporate decision-makers. And the success or failure of a beautiful, bold design tells me something about what citizens do with their money in relation to the state of the economy. So there really is a lot to talk about.
I'm not particularly wealthy, and I guessed that the Pagoda is my best compromise between what I can afford and what I might aspire to. If I had Steve Plunkett's money, I'd be interested in a lot more than Cadillacs, that's for sure. At the recent Concours of America, I almost fell down on my knees and cried when I saw my first Maserati 3500 GT. What a lovely car! So in the end, it's about more than just whether it's a Mercedes.
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My daily driver is a Toyota Tacoma (Hilux for the rest of the world) and they do not get more reliable than that. I prefer to keep the cars that cost the most to own as weekend drivers since I am part of the middle class.
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My view on this
Brand - MB over all in terms of reliability but not styling
Style - Pagoda over all else - thats personal taste
Class of use - its horses for courses, we have VW T5 Multivan for transport, F612 for style,performance and whatthehellism, and of course the Pagoda as a lifetime always wanted one.
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I run four cars, two new and two old and as you can see from the signature block, VW and Mercedes, one old and one new of each brand.
For different reasons I like both brands but having had lots of Japanese in the distance past, I do prefer the German cars. In Australia the import taxes have been reducing for some time now and the Euro cars are now very competitive with all others and we are seeing lots more on the roads.
Garry
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I run four cars, two new and two old and as you can see from the signature block, VW and Mercedes, one old and one new of each brand.
For different reasons I like both brands but having had lots of Japanese in the distance past, I do prefer the German cars. In Australia the import taxes have been reducing for some time now and the Euro cars are now very competitive with all others and we are seeing lots more on the roads.
Garry
How much are these taxes you talk about?
We pay 5% and some duty depending on year and where the car was built.
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Oh dear, interesting to see this. In the Netherlands the tax on a car is dependant upon the CO2 emissions that the car has, and varies from €0 to €21485 + € 551 / gram of CO2. On top of that, 21% of BTW (our VAT) is added. Examples:
- Volkswagen Golf, 1.4 TSI, Highline, 7 gear DSG, base price € 20789, total price (tax and BPM) € 27790, i.e. + 33%.7
- Mercedes Benz E-class, E500 Prestige, 7G-Tronic, Base price € 67653, total price (tax and BPM) € 97825, i.e. +44.6%
In other words, for an economical car, taxes are over 33% of the purchase price in the Netherlands, for a gas guzzler, over 45%. It's the same in most European countries...
Peter
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Everyone is different. My car choices are driven somewhat by rarity and power, even for daily drivers. I don't like getting lost in a mall parking lot looking for a white Toyota among hundreds of them. Seems like many cars look similar nowadays. Not the W113!
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Smart ForTwo just introduced their Gen2 (v2) electric, ZEV car. $139 per month, for a 3 year lease.
http://www.mnn.com/green-tech/transportation/blogs/daimler-offers-best-new-deal-in-battery-car-leasing-139-a-month-for
http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1086087_2013-smart-electric-drive-coupe-lease-price-lowered-to-139
In some states, like Georgia, there is a tax credit of up to $5000 on a ZEV. So on this new Smart, the 3 year lease is $5,004.00. The tax credit is $5,000.
http://www.gaepd.org/Files_PDF/forms/apb/apb_levzevfs.pdf
Line begins at the SmartCenter of Alpharetta...
So much for expensive taxes...
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I've seen a lot of nice models and brands over the years, but there hasn't ever and won't ever be anything like that large chrome three pointed star on the hood gleaming as you pull up to the valet
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I've worked on and driven just about every post war model of MB produced from 1950 - 1990. Every one one of them has some interesting feature but the 111 coupe is hard to beat for comfort and style. The 300SL roaster is in a league all its own and until you've owned, driven, and worked on a 600 you really can't say you've seen automotive brillance at its best. This car impresses on every level.
I still have a fondness for L29 Cords, Talbot Lagos, 1930's Alfas, and anything Delehaye. Pure art deco sexy.
I like the Rocket because it's my creation using every available high performance part from the era.
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For me, I definitely think it is about the Model and the Car as Art. While I am currently having an affair with my 291 Dark Olive 280SL that I've coveted since I was 12, I'm already turning my gaze toward my next sweetheart. I know, that's Bigamy, but here goes.
That would be a 1958 Imperial, 20 1/2 feet of finned fun. 392 Hemi, and lots of room to stick your hand under the dash. Probably a father approval thing, (he had a black one back when Kennedy was President), but I love the lines, the broad chrome, and the trunk horizontal faux continental tire look. Push button transmission, space age floating tail lights, and a real Land Yacht experience. 1960 is great too, but has a common 413 Wedge. My first car was a Mopar Dodge Challenger which caused me all kind of trouble (with tickets and insurance). I'm pretty sure I'll find the one I want in the next year or two. Wouldn't be caught dead in a Chevy or Ford, sorry. (Although a 1930's Packard would be amazing). And I have no interest in these plastic teardrop looking benzes, beemers, and other new cars that perform great, but look like Camry's. I also have no interest in Mopars beyond the year 1970, so I'm clearly not wedded to the brand.
Of course, I would love to have a coffin nosed supercharged Cord 812. That car is pure Artwork. But I am too old for a rust-bucket, and can't afford one in pristine shape. Maybe Jay Leno will liquidate his garages in a few weeks and retire to a tropical island.
I hope all of the Teutonophiles on the site forgive me for my transgressive lust, but I'll make sure my 280 still gets plenty of attention.
Any other Land Yacht or Fin fans out there?
Mike Mizesko
Columbus, OH
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In the movie Tin Men with Danny de Vito and Richard Dreyfuss a lot of early sixties and late fifties Cadillacs feature and some of those I think are gorgeous: El Dorado, Fleetwood and Coupe de Villemostly, fins galore. Good examples are quite affordable too.
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Cees,
Tin Men was a great car movie. I do find that I am starting to watch movies and shows from the 50's and 60's more for the cars. Just saw one the other day "By Love Posessed" with Lana Turner driving a white 190SL. Also fun to watch "Highway Patrol" with Broderick Crawford.
One of my favorites (second to the Imperial) is Peter Gunn's 1959 Sport Fury Convertible. Google it sometime. Those are hard to find beauties. And Lola Albright was easy on the eyes too.
Cheers!
Mike
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As much as I love to drive the w113, the workhorse of my stable is a Ford F150. Tows boats, hauls appliances and lumber, great reliable work truck. The E500 (5 speed) I own is stylish and comfortable but not reliable. I hope I do not get flamed for this statement, but the newer MB seem to suffer from Quality Control and with the price tag a consumer pays you should not have to worry about the constant electrical problems, tranny issues and numerous service bulletins. I would not own a modem Mercedes again too many sensors, too much time in the shop and major design flaws. The newer 7 speed transmission of the E550 has had many issues from what I heard.
I will say my good friend is over 200K m. on his second MLB. He has to repair it quite often but it still drives well for having 200K on the odometer. I have also heard the 6cyclinder modem Mercs is much more reliable than the V8 although they have known problems as well. I have spoken with former Benz owners that traded their MB in for a LEXUS or BMW and get the same level of comfort but it has the reliability and ease of ownership that many modern Mercedes are lacking but maybe mine was built on a Friday :D
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:( Sad but true. Tired of constant repairs on my newer Benz I traded it for another German brand :)