Retrosound Dual Voice Coil Speaker

[mbcko]

Hello

Has anybody tried the item in the link below?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/RetroSound-R-48N-120-watt-Dual-Voice-Coil-DVC-Ultra-Thin-4x8-Speaker-Mercedes-/181182196144?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Model%3A230SL&hash=item2a2f4ce9b0&vxp=mtr#ht_6487wt_1158

Could prove very useful as front / tune up modern speakers replacement...

The add claims that they are a direct drop-in replacement.

Would be very interested to hear any positive or negative experiences...

thanks in advance

Robert

[66andBlue]

The original front speaker is 2" x 8", these speakers are 4" x 8" and will not fit.

[GGR]

I did try to fit that retrosound dual voice speaker on my '71 280SL and it wouldn't fit. I had to return it and they retained 20% out of the refund, though they specify the speaker fits in Pagodas in their product description.

[mdsalemi]

Just as a reminder, a 4 x 8 or 4 x 6 or 6 x 8 automotive speaker is fairly common.  These do NOT fit in a Pagoda, surely not in the traditional dash space.

The OEM 2 x 8 is very rare indeed and you don't have much choice...

Today, there are probably some very miniature speakers one could jerry-rig into the space, but just be aware of impedance matching...

[mbcko]

Thanks to all for your prompt responses and advice.

[ageorge]

If you have approx. 30 hrs. to waste, a dremel tool with a cut out blade { many Blades }, it will fit.

[teleandatwin]

I bought this and can confirm it doesn't fit. I also have their Bluetooth radio which looks and performs great. I suggested they remove it from their site as a fit for our cars....

Paul

[KevinC]

Here's a couple that should fit...

http://www.authenticclassics.com/Dash-Speaker-for-230SL-250SL-280SL-Other-Mods-p/auth-002720.htm

http://www.vintageeuroparts.com/100261.html

Becker sells them too but they don't display their prices on their site.

[GGR]

The advantage of the dual voice is that it can be wired out of a stereo system. In my case the plan was to have two speakers in the foot well plus a third one in the dash. Too bad it didn't fit. Using a regular speaker is fine with a mono set-up, but I wonder how this could be combined in a stereo set up with speakers in the foot-wells already. If there is a way, I'm interested in trying it.

[66andBlue]

GGR,
I am not sure what you want to do. You can easily combine a third mono or a third stereo speaker with your existing two stereo speakers in the foot wells. But you cannot use this dual voice speaker because it does not fit into the dash - you could mount on the parcel shelf if you wanted. In any case keep in mind that the old Becker radios do not put out more than about 7 Watts.

[GGR]

I have my original Becker stereo radio put aside and replaced it with one of these retro-sound radios which is also stereo. I have one speaker in each foot well and I still have two sets of unused wires for two additional speakers. I could hook the dash speaker to one of them, but I would then have two "left" or two "right" speakers and only one of the other side. I wonder if this is not going to distort the sound in some ways. The dual voice was interesting because I could have hooked both sets of wires so the sound would have remained balanced. Is there a way to connect a standard speaker for it to get 100% of the sound like on a mono set up (by hooking both sets of wires?) without damaging the radio, and still keeping the two other ones working in a stereo mode?

[66andBlue]

I assume your Retro radio has four speaker outputs, something like this: front (L)/front(R)/rear(L)/rear(R)
and you have only used the two for the front speakers. To use the other two outputs to drive a mono speaker you cannot just combine them but need to build a summing circuit as described here:
http://www.rane.com/note109.html
The simple "Stereo-to-Mono Summing Box" with 2x 475 OHM + 1x 20K Ohm should be sufficient for your purpose. The text/diagram shows 3.5mm connectors but of course you can use RCA jacks/connectors too.

If you want more in depth detail then this page might be useful:
http://www.bcae1.com/trimode.htm
but make sure to read this also: http://www.bcae1.com/bridging.htm

[GGR]

Thank you. This really helps. So I need a Stereo-to-Mono Summing Box. I looked for a ready made one but the connections imply RCA etc. Isn't there a simple cheap one where on can just screw the wires in and out? Couldn't find that on the net.

[Cees Klumper]

@ GGR: what I might do in your situation is rather than go with such a small single front speaker + the whole stero-to-mono-box-conversion is take a pair of self-enclosed small speakers to put on the rear shelves, run wiring underneath the carpet with quick connectors to these removable speakers, and just use them for much better sound in the rear, supporting the front speakers in the footwells, and then being able to remove them invisibly for shows etc (since you probably don't want to install any permanent speakers in the rear parcel shelves). Much better sound plus reversibility and less work it would seem.

[GGR]

I did think about that, as I've seen several set-ups of that kind at the Williamsburg gathering. The thing is I'm using my car for travels and the rear shelves invariably end up with all kind of stuff piled up on each other. The two current speakers in the foot wells are OK at highway speed with the hard top on, but I guess they will have a bit of a hard time with the soft top. This is why I thought the help of a third speaker, right on top of the dash, may be enough, without having to deal with additional boxes on the rear shelves. I can try that, and in case it is not satisfactory, I will go for the additional speakers on the rear shelves.   

[66andBlue]

If you have already a third mono speaker in the dash then I would just buy the three resistors and make up a cable to the speaker as shown by this fellow:
http://ryanj.info/Projects/monosum2.htm
And you don't need the higher rated resistors that he bought, channel separation is not a problem for our purpose.
If you don't have a third speaker then buy two tiny ones - they even come with the Star - and put them into the dash with Velcro and use the two extra wires from your radio to wire them up:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/310816400274
They are so cheap you can use them as decoration later if you don't like the sound! 

[philmas]

Hello CGR!
Why dońt you consider installing two little tweeters in the dash space and use the main speakers  in the footwells as boomers in a two- way system?
Of course, this would mean using some sort of crossover between the components, but a  simple one could do imho.
Or even fit a 2way kit from one of the current car audio brands available on the market (pioneer, infinity, or Focal-cocorico!)...but on a higher budget.

[GGR]

Philippe, I like the idea. I think it's better than a third speaker. I will look into it when I have time!

[Khurram Darugar]

Im planning to do what phillipe has suggested after mulling this for several months.
Has anyone tried this?  I have the feeling that an external amp would be needed.
If anyone has any suggestions as to what 2 way works well and postioning direction of the tweeters, id appreciate it.
Thanks
Kay

[philmas]

As stated, an external amp is , imho, mandatory.The original Becker amp is indeed far too weak, outputting no more than 2X7 watts, leading to distorsion as volume increases.
It could be fitted somewhere under or behind the glove box, in lieu et place of the Becker's.
As for the tweeters, they should fit in the dash place, but some kind of an adapter would be required.
Ideally, they should face backwards (i.e towards you), but if they face upwards, the sound would be reflected on the windscreen and might still be OK.
if you decide to go for a 2 way kit, the crossover will be supplied as well.
Of course, there's a bit of a wiring job down there...

[jeblack123]

GGR,

Sorry that I am late to the conversation but here is a link on Amazon for Infinity tweeter's that I used to install in the center section of my Pagoda.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002A98OMA/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?ie=UTF8&psc=1

On sale for about $45.00. I used the kick panels to install midrange speakers and have a subwoofer installed under the right rear parcel shelf in a custom enclosure.

The tweeters come with mounting hardware that will allow you to angle he speakers according to your listening preferences. I installed them on a rectangular mounting board that sits in the center section without any modification to the vehicle or wooden grill and adds significantly to the sound quality of my stereo.

I can take and post photos later this week if anyone is interested.

James

[GGR]

Thanks James. Indeed pictures would be welcome!

[Khurram Darugar]

"have a subwoofer installed under the right rear parcel shelf in a custom enclosure"
Would be interested to see how this was done.
Cheers
Kay

[Tomnistuff]

I've never been happy with my radio and speaker system, installed by the previous owner.  A Phillips AM/FM/Tape with two front speakers.

I've said in the past, "I tend to be a purist, but I'm not a masochist."  I'm also not an audiophile, so I decided to install a modern Retro-style radio system (CASMFG USA-4DIN driving four 40W JVC 4" speakers).

I have and like my Kinder Seat, so parcel shelf speakers are not an option.  My solution for rear speakers is shown in the photos.  The first photo was taken before the passenger side pilot holes were enlarged to be like the driver's side.  The speaker spacing provides for the Kinder Seat and its passenger.  I'll re-glue the carpeting to the wall everywhere except where the grill holes are.  There are already lots of holes between the cabin and the trunk so a few more small ones should be OK.  Structurally, the bulkhead will provide the same backing for the carpet.  I've tested the carpet effect on sound by isolating one of my family car speakers and pressing the carpet tightly over it.  The effect is a minor reduction in treble and a slight reduction in volume, an effect that I find acceptable for rear speakers.

The speakers are accessible because the speaker boxes are hinged and latched wooden $2 craft boxes from the dollar store, covered with felt and lined inside with thicker jute.  There are convection air circulation holes in the top and bottom to provide any cooling required.

My front speakers will be in the panels above the driver's and passenger's legs, so all speakers will be out of sight.

The only difficulty was designing a grill pattern (I found a pattern on the web), then drilling (142) 1/16" pilot holes, then re-drilling them to 3/16" and spacing the speakers away from the rear of the wall so as not to have speaker contact with the wall except where the mounting flanges are.  Normally, a four inch hole is required for speaker mounting - not acceptable for me.

Since I know nothing about sound systems, I took a mechanical engineer's approach.  I hope when I turn up the sound, I don't vibrate the taillamps off the car.

Tom Kizer

[RonB]

I have been toying this idea: Make a metal plate 2 x 8 and punch 2 holes in it for the front grill as tweeters.

Put a base amp and speaker under the front seat drier side ( cooler ). BMW does it on there cars.

Retro-sound sells flat kick panels with speaker holes. The large one for the late 30's truck seem likes a good size to kick panel could be positioned to fit. I then would cut the panel excess away and have one that fits. Less cost then building one. It would be out of ABS or similar material.

I will be sending a template this Monday and see which one would fill the kick panel with the speaker in the far back.

I do want one that looks pregnant. . The original kick panels would remain the same and undamaged. The new panel could be painted to match or covered with leather.

In this was you would have 2 midrange - 2 high range and a base with amp.

Feedback would welcome.